Schroder sq and the new talea


I heard there was to be a fun time of learning and comparing of these two arms at the rmaf. Since the talea is relatively new, it still has to stand the test of time with comparisons on other tables, other systems and the selective and subjective tastes of discerning audiophiles! There is to be a comparison in one of the rooms at the rmaf this year, which i wasnt able to make. I would be curious to hear some judicial, diplomatic, friendly talk about how they compared to each other in the same system and room. I currently own the origin live silver mk3 with a jan allaerts mc1bmk2 and am enjoying this combo but have become curious about the more popular "superarms" Hats off to both frank and joel.

I hope this thread draws more light rather than heat. If someone preferred one arm over the other it would be OK. With all the variables it doesnt mean that much to me. What matters to me is what it sounds like to me and in my room. With that said...

What was your bias? was it for the schroder or the talea?

cheers!...
vertigo
Dear Dertonarm: The Guillermo and I main target on our tonearm design is not mainly what MS, Technics and others did it in their designs to give the user/customer own tonearm facilities to match cartridge/tonearm resonance frequency, this is important but I learn that there are other more critical factors down there that affect the quality performance level.

As you point out our main target is that through " perfect mechanic-dynamic " each cartridge you mount in our tonearm can shows at its best like in almost no any other tonearm and this is our meaning of " universal tonearm ".

It is a very hard challenge for any one that want to design a tonearm. Are there trade-offs to achieve that target?, certainly are and Guillermo and I really analize each one of them and its influence ( what we are " loosing " in change of what. ) on playback quality performance level, even if a customer could detect something because those trade-offs.

Design a tonearm with our main target is a deep learning in something that appear very simple: a tonearm design is no rocket to Pluton!, but when you understand that that tonearm is only a 1/2-half product and you need to add the cartridge ( that fussy and multifacetic cartridge along several and different cartridges!!!. ) ) in the " equation " design then that simple tonearm design converts in something more a lot more complex.

It is not only our each one skills to design it but the way we use those skills where the time consuming on tests/voicing is higher than I could imagine at first but a extreme necessity to confirm if we are just " there ".

These tests take me and still take not only several hours for cartridges set up but to listening. I have to develop a process that make me not only more " easy " to find out/detect the differences but that asure me those differences were real because are these differences the ones that tell you if the " light " is still off or you already switch: ON!.

We are ( I think. ) at the finish part/step/stage of our tonearm design and we hope to share it to all of you in the next months ( 2011. ).

Anyway an interesting project full of several learning subjects and full of fun.

Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.
Has Mike Lavinge expressed his views on the comparison between the two tonearms in another thread?

I was looking forward to reading his version of events....
Dear Raul,
I'm wondering what principles first guide your design choices for this 'Universal' tonearm?
Do you start with a low mass design for high compliance cartridges (which you prefer) and then 'tweek' it to sound well with low compliance cartidges or vice versa?

I'm guessing that in any case it's a unipivot design......right?

Good luck
Henry
What Palasr said.
I sensed that most of the listeners came into the room with a bias, and since the test was hardly blinded, let alone double-blinded, most people I talked to "heard" differences that were ascribable to their own perceptions of how the two designs SHOULD differ sonically, given the differences in their construction. I am not saying this is the case for Mike L, since I did not get to talk to him after the session. Anyway, he has a much better data base (extensive listening in his home environment) for making a judgement.

All I could tell was that I heard two different tonearm/cartridge/phono stage systems that sounded different from each other, not surprisingly and given my rather poor listening position.