Dear Dev: These are statements you posted through the thread where you stated that " seep accuracy " issue:
" I'm sorry but to me if you own a table and it can't hold an accurate speed it's flawed, no matter what else you do latter really doesn't matter because the speed needs to be accurate. "
" it wasn't just because not being able to produce ACCURATE SPEED.
," have friends whom also own TW AC's and not one can hold an accurate speed using the TimeLine so go figure. "
" any of you guys actually owned and lived with both TW's AC3 and Black Knight tables and used a TimeLine on either to set-up the speed? "
" The controller does not allow fine tuning so one can not get the speed bang on "
" Dgad mentioned his table now is locked in on the 33.3 speed "
" Then you have others that feel one can't hear the difference if the speed is not locked in and try to discredit, for the life of me just makes me laugh. "
" when I was addressing the issue with my controller and not being able to keep an accurate speed and what I was hearing "
all those information came from 8 different posts.
I asked which was value/quantity of the TT speed deviations, example: from 33.333 to 33.37 or to 33.28 rpm or what ever and till now you did not give us an answer. You always talked on non speed accuracy but seems to me with out knowing what we are talking about: how higher was that TW speed deviation, even you don't speak if that deviation was a constant one or if it has short term fluctuations.
IMHO speak of speed inacuracies is not a fact but to know which kind of speed deviaitions we have: this means we need to measure it if not why are you using the Timeline as the tool to state the TW speed accuracy?
I'm not questioning your very high sensitivity to tiny changes on TW speed, good that you have it. What I'm trying to figure is what in a hell you was hearing on your TW TTs because that tiny speed deviations when before you owned the TW TT probably you already had with your other TTs?
Your main subject is: non accurate speed, fine. I posted that there is no single audio item that's perfect and that all audio items have some kind of virtues and some defects. I posted too that you never mentioned not even one TW virtue and my question is:
is so bad that has not a single performance virtue?, if from your point of view it has some virtues: why did not mentioned?, could you?
The other subject is that you put 90% of the TW culprit to that non accurate speed and that could be a little unfair because TT speed accuracy is only one factor/parameter involved on the whole quality performance level, there are " hundred " of factors ( other than speed. ) that could be easily the culprit of your dissatisfaction on what you heard it.
In the other side, you are talking of " accuracy " when your system goes around non-accurate tube technology trhough the system electronics even at phono stage. IMHO you have more unaccuracies there than on that TW speed deviations ( that today we don't know about the " magnitude " you are blamed it. ).
No I don't want to open the tube technology subject and please don't open it: you only can lose with.
Peterayer posted:
" Regarding pitch control: SME turntables and many other belt drive turntables are criticized for not being speed accurate. There are at least five top classical conductors and 10-20 professional musicians in Europe who own SME tables and the dealer from whom they bought their tables recently told me that not one has ever complained about the his table having pitch problems. And this is a group of owners who know how music sounds. "
yes some one of us could be even more sensitive than musicians/composers and the like of speed deviations and I'm glad to know that you are one of those priviliged audiophiles.
++" In the end as long as you are enjoying what ever it may be that's all that matters " ++++++
Agree with you.
Regards and enjoy the music,
R.
" I'm sorry but to me if you own a table and it can't hold an accurate speed it's flawed, no matter what else you do latter really doesn't matter because the speed needs to be accurate. "
" it wasn't just because not being able to produce ACCURATE SPEED.
," have friends whom also own TW AC's and not one can hold an accurate speed using the TimeLine so go figure. "
" any of you guys actually owned and lived with both TW's AC3 and Black Knight tables and used a TimeLine on either to set-up the speed? "
" The controller does not allow fine tuning so one can not get the speed bang on "
" Dgad mentioned his table now is locked in on the 33.3 speed "
" Then you have others that feel one can't hear the difference if the speed is not locked in and try to discredit, for the life of me just makes me laugh. "
" when I was addressing the issue with my controller and not being able to keep an accurate speed and what I was hearing "
all those information came from 8 different posts.
I asked which was value/quantity of the TT speed deviations, example: from 33.333 to 33.37 or to 33.28 rpm or what ever and till now you did not give us an answer. You always talked on non speed accuracy but seems to me with out knowing what we are talking about: how higher was that TW speed deviation, even you don't speak if that deviation was a constant one or if it has short term fluctuations.
IMHO speak of speed inacuracies is not a fact but to know which kind of speed deviaitions we have: this means we need to measure it if not why are you using the Timeline as the tool to state the TW speed accuracy?
I'm not questioning your very high sensitivity to tiny changes on TW speed, good that you have it. What I'm trying to figure is what in a hell you was hearing on your TW TTs because that tiny speed deviations when before you owned the TW TT probably you already had with your other TTs?
Your main subject is: non accurate speed, fine. I posted that there is no single audio item that's perfect and that all audio items have some kind of virtues and some defects. I posted too that you never mentioned not even one TW virtue and my question is:
is so bad that has not a single performance virtue?, if from your point of view it has some virtues: why did not mentioned?, could you?
The other subject is that you put 90% of the TW culprit to that non accurate speed and that could be a little unfair because TT speed accuracy is only one factor/parameter involved on the whole quality performance level, there are " hundred " of factors ( other than speed. ) that could be easily the culprit of your dissatisfaction on what you heard it.
In the other side, you are talking of " accuracy " when your system goes around non-accurate tube technology trhough the system electronics even at phono stage. IMHO you have more unaccuracies there than on that TW speed deviations ( that today we don't know about the " magnitude " you are blamed it. ).
No I don't want to open the tube technology subject and please don't open it: you only can lose with.
Peterayer posted:
" Regarding pitch control: SME turntables and many other belt drive turntables are criticized for not being speed accurate. There are at least five top classical conductors and 10-20 professional musicians in Europe who own SME tables and the dealer from whom they bought their tables recently told me that not one has ever complained about the his table having pitch problems. And this is a group of owners who know how music sounds. "
yes some one of us could be even more sensitive than musicians/composers and the like of speed deviations and I'm glad to know that you are one of those priviliged audiophiles.
++" In the end as long as you are enjoying what ever it may be that's all that matters " ++++++
Agree with you.
Regards and enjoy the music,
R.