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Which cables go with what?????

I never fails to amaze me, the questions people ask on this forum, always trying to find some synergy between cables and their components/speakers.

The fact is: there are two classes of cables:
1) Those that are neutral
2) Those that impose a sonic signature (tone controls of a sort)

If the average audiophile spent his time trying to weed-out the tone control cables and get some neutral cables, then all that would be left is to determine the right synergy between his or her components. This may mean elimination of an offensive component, as painful as that sounds.

Component synergy is real. Amps and speaker combinations definitely need to be selected carefully. In some cases also preamp-amp synergies are important. If you are using tubes, then there are even more compatibility issues. But cables, forget it. If you are trying to compensate for a poor component or speaker design by using tone control cables, you will probably never be happy and likely compromise the sound of the other components in the process. You will certainly never approach a live or "master-tape" sound. There, that's my editorial. Hopefully some will learn from it.
audioengr
s23chang
620 posts
 
Ridgestreetaudio's way of making the "neutral" is based on data you collected and not based on physical property of the cable you make. This is a good approach and I've done the same myself to determine what's "neutral" to me. What you're doing is helping your clients learn how to match their system (As I mentioned in my previous post.) On behave of your clients I would thank you for your effort(I actually never audition your cable before) of making everyone enjoy their system. This is exactly what Sean said:

"If both systems are deemed to be "accurate" and / or "musical", etc..., then it really doesn't matter HOW we got there. The end result is the same, we just took different paths."

In another words, a cable doesn't have to be neutral as long as the system is neutral.
This is the my first thought when I became an audiophile and it is still my strong believe. Regardless of what speaker, amps, preamps, and cables you have, as long as the source is the same then the output should be the same with slight difference is detail and presentation.
i.e. A violin should sound like violin but detail and imaging can vary. However, many folks disagree with me because they believe in component dependent rather than end result.
sean
6,231 posts
 
S23: Since each component will influence the sound, both on its' own and due to the inter-action with other components, everybody is right. That's why i have a hard time writing reviews for equipment i.e. change the combo of equipment and you'll change the entire presentation. We are not hearing any specific aspect of any given component, but how that one component responds and causes responses with the other components in that system. That is why it is called "system synergy" i.e. we hear the entire package as an end result. If we wanted to be fair, we could also call it "component compatability" since one change affects the whole system but those changes are directly related to that one component swap. By "component", i'm including ANYTHING that signal passes through and even the AC supply to some extent. Sean
>

PS to Audioengr: If you can perform the tests mentioned above between an amp and preamp with the amp driving highly reactive speakers, you'll really see what i was talking about in terms of the load "modulating" the source and different cables and length of cables compounding or buffering this effect. Given the amps that you have, it may do better than others with this though as i have a good amount of confidence in the designer of these specific products.
lemec5b2
67 posts
 
Sean, have you demonstrated the dynamic loading you describe? Have pictures(not those kinds:))?

One other point is many of the sonic qualities used to describe the differences beteween cables are identical to those you would expect to describe the sound between a system in and outside of an rfi environment. Terms like "dynamic compression, zippy-highs, no bass" etc. probably mean that rfi to some extent is entering or overloading the input stage or even causing oscillations in an output stage. That would explain why some cables work in some systems and not others, it depends on each components resistanse to environmental factors which will change depending on the loading to each other.

A cable with good shielding may have a higher capacitance that the output stage doesn't like, that's why a good component should be able to drive significant capacitance, then differences between well sheilded cables will be negligible. So in difference to these cable manufacturers claims, picking a good component first will eliminate the never ending cable search, just find one with good sheilding and construction.

steve
subaruguru
1,376 posts
 
Hi guys. I'm packing for Italy for a month, so didn't read the thread. Guess I'll miss a lot. Have a fine August, everyone. Ernie
audioengr OP
3,282 posts
 
Flex wrote:
"In response to the original post, cable differences go deeper than coloration. Two cables can be equally neutral on chromatic scale, yet differ greatly in macro/micro dynamics, noise floor, speed, clarity, detail resolution versus smoothness, and quality of imaging."

I agree completely. The confusion has to do with the definition of the word "neutral". In this sense, I use it to mean a cable that imparts no sound of its own. This is much more than just a flat steady-state spectral response.
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