Safe audiogon transactions; lowering the bar.

Good points Will. I never thought of COD as a vehicle to provide quicker shipping & better packing. I'm always open to another way to approach something, be it use COD or switch from the SS camp to tubes. Open to but not ready to jump ship, I might add.

I read your post & thought it had valid points. I put myself in the seller's shoes to you & asked myself if I would have a problem doing a COD deal. First I would check your feedback-there is none. That in itself is not a problem as you've been posting for awhile. I would then look through your posts, which I did, to see what kind of person I was dealing with. From that I would not have a problem dealing with you & I did enjoy reading the "fishing" post the other day. The iconoclastic position intrigues me as I long ago read Thomas Szazz but that is a topic for another time. I would then follow up with a phone call to get a feel for how you conduct business and that would give you a chance to also make a decision.

Bottom line is every transaction needs to be dealt with on a case by case basis & there are several methods to ensure a safe & positive outcome for both parties. COD has been abused & is therefore suspect in a lot of peoples minds. Used properly I can see the benefits but that can be said of any number of so called "programs".

It's fun to see how suspicious minds deal with risk. The truth for everyone here who trades cash for goods is that there are no guarantees. Cod does present the risk of there being A.......s like that thief last summer from San Diego who paid cod's with forged certified checks to the tune of 100k+ and those who speak about boxes with no goods in them. I'll never understand those who have little or no transaction history and are untrusting of others who have substantial immaculate transaction history, and believe that cod is the answer. It kinda makes me suspicious of them!!!

Even in the box, in person transactions can be tainted. In person only assures the players that there is an item and that there is cash. NO more!

The protection under Paypal is only concerning verified members up to $200??? And when shipped to a verified address and when the claim is made within 30 days of payment. I have been clipped twice on ebay by CD/R sales which I thought Ebay would handle and by the time I didn?t get re-payment, it was over the 30 days. Not much money involved, but no repayment. Paypal has no guarantee against chargebacks when the purchaser uses a credit card as payment method. BIG RISK!

Wire transfers have clear advantages. Initially, banks have verifiability of accounts with tax id's and other bank references, generally including credit histories. Additionally, in order to wire funds, the seller has to provide verification of who, where and telephone confirmation numbers all of which can be checked. Reverse look up phone numbers for addresses and if not satisfied, ask for the audio shop the piece was purchased at and then look up the number and call the shop. Sellers can provide their bankers names and phone numbers as well. There is at a minimum very little likelihood of fraud by anonymity.

With the above available, I?d never ship cod to anyone with low feedback. EVER! Yes, anyone who does buy from me is taking a risk. But that risk isn?t that I won?t ship or that the goods aren?t as advertised, only that they won?t like what they thought they would.

Wires can't be stopped once received except for bank error. So, at least one half of the risk is removed. No method other than in person exchange completely eliminates the risk to the second party of not receiving the goods.

It?s unfortunate that only one side of the risk can be eliminated. But, given that fact, it?s 100% better than both sides being at risk.

Bill E.

Interesting point of view, Bill, in that you detail all the steps you take to protect yourself from uscrupulous buyers yet bristle at the idea that buyers might desire to protect themselves from unscrupulous sellers, as well.

This isn't about paranoia, it is about playing on a level field. I'm dubious about sellers who say "trust me" but obviously don't trust their customers.

Bill, what you said...
"I'll never understand those who have little or no transaction history and are untrusting of others who have substantial immaculate transaction history, and believe that cod is the answer. It kinda makes me suspicious of them!!! "
I once had the pleasure of dealing with exactly that type of buyer & under those same circumstances; yes I was suspicious of someone who wouldn't even trust a seller with immaculate credentials. This guy wouldn't trust his own mother! I tried to accomodate him initially but the COD became such a hassle that I rescinded the offer. I then got slammed with 3 illegal neg. feedback postings (Audiogon fixed that of course). Later I found out from 2 other sellers that they had experienced significant problems with this clown. I was sure glad that I listened to my gut feelings; I could just tell that he was a jerk from the very beginning.