Chris,
Here ya go again. I wrote to you personally to end this arguing, and instead you question timelines.
I write to you as an ally, and you bite my ass. Sigh....
Your request of me to not reference your designs in my ads is puzzling. Unless I'm mistaken I don't believe I mention your name directly or by specific association; I'll check again to make sure. But methinks you paint the herring red here....
I installed dedicated lines with 83802 in late 2000, which I referred to as two years ago last fall when I decided to offer the Kits. It's now been 2 1/2 years. The actual PCs were built afterward, as I didn't figure out where to get IECs until much later. Hence the post in 01. What's your point? Or are you just assailing muy integrity?
Eagle, I have no idea what Belden says about 110v use. We all are using 8380x for that, and its a dandy cable. The issue probably relates to whether the outside soft Teflon jacket is abrasion-resistant enough to use without conduit.
In most cases it is, but I suspect that most inspectors would want to see it protected further. But i have not heard of ANY problems thus far. I agree that the use of a third conductor (83803) is preferable to 83802's shield-as-ground vis-a-vis safety issues. Unfortunately the 83803 costs a full 50% more. The preferable solution is indeed to counterspiral a cheap 10THHN 12AWG ground outside the matrix, and then slide it through a conduit of some type, per Audioengineer, et al, above.
Re intellectual property: Chris' choice of 83802 as a two-pole power delivery cable is certainly insufficiently different from the intended normal use of the stuff to constitute propriety. The only difference is perhaps 24v vs 115v, if one wanted to stretch it.
I know that there are SEVERAL manufacturers of $$$ PC that use Belden's 8380x, and would certainly chuckle if presented with a cease 'n desist because someone thought of it too and asked for exclusive rights. And what would Belden have to say about it?
I can understand that someone wouldn't want to have their actual copy, diagrams, drawings. etc., electronically copied for commercial use without permission.
My only actions are to assemble the parts required to make a fine PC from a pre-existing cable along with my choice of connectors and outer jacket. It's interesting that Audioengineer posts above "his" idea for a counterwound external safety ground. By extension this is also a borrowed use of Chris' "design"? C'mon!
Chris is going to unveil a very similar cable that is completely his ownership. In this case he can rightfully control marketing, licensing, etc.
But asking for permission to use Belden 8380x in a 115v application is like me asking others to request my permission to use the slightly different-sized Yokohamas that I discovered improve the handling of Outbacks. Sure I
"discovered" the excellence of this application, but I don't doubt that others have also "designed" such an application in parallel. And why should anyone care?
Audioengineer:
I'm curious about your statement. Many of us use a floated ground in PCs to drain unwanted junk. Lower noisefloor usually results, certainly with no loss of dynamics.
I'd be grateful for more elucidation. I've enjoyed your previous technical posts. Thanks.
Chris,
As you and I have noted, DIY PC building is a satisfying, cost-effective way of enjoying our hobby inexpensively.
NOT ONE PERSON who has contacted me re power applications has referred to my Kits-assembling convenience as a theft, borrowing, or copying of another's design...especially yours! Once or twice (that's it) I've been asked about other assembly geometries that resemble "Chris' other flavors", and simply comment according to their technical merits as I see them.
My point is that there is no choice customers seem too be making re "who they want to do business with" based upon anything but totally ethical, fairly objective (we all try!), low-cost practices. I have had no derogatory feedback re your business practices, nor mine. We're both
doing a good thing here, so I really would like to see a reorientation of your perspective toward my efforts. If anything your name is held in higher esteem by those who have assembled my kit and have known about you beforehand.
I appreciate that a few enquirers know a bit about 83802 from your site before they contact me, as well, although that does seem to be a small minority of those I've communicated with.
I'm rather surprised that there would be any concern about the possibility of intellectual profiteering in my part-time endeavors marketing a $35 product when there are others out there chsrging hundreds of dollars for this "design" incognito! Guess my transparency makes me an easy target? I suggest we focus on debunking the megaprofiteers nstead of squabbling with each other.
Thanks.
Ern
