Copies Better Than Originals?


...Anyone with experience or knowledge about serious claims that the Pioneer CDR W739 (or 839) produces recorded copies which are of better quality than the originals? If so, how is it accomplished?
wrayray
That's a fun reading Ehider. However, since you don't own the master tape or you were live from recording studio, therefore, "details closer to the original" can not be proven in any way. The copy tend to have some information lost so that some high frequency got roll off. My system is revealing enough that we can tell that copied CD tend to sound more round but slightly dull compared to original. also definitely the lost of fine detail. On the copied CD, we can't hear the fine detail of guitarist picking on the string which produced a slight high pitch noise for less than a split second nor as the background noise from the audience clearing his throat. Also, the front to back presentation is less spacious imaging compared to original. The drum sounded more fuzzy (which added more glow) compared to original. Overall sound is more "damped" than the original.
We even verified and compared the CDs bit to bit on a computer to prove that they're identical. It looks 100% the same on computer but it doesn't sound the same.
However, we can't tell the difference when these CDs apart were played on a boom box and walkman.
Only thing I conclude is that copied CD is not at acceptable level if you have hi end and very revealing system. It's still the only good source to backup your music and it is still good if fine details are not critical.
See the Genesis Speakers website for research that was done using black blanks and CD recorder in computers.
http://www.genesisloudspeakers.com/whitepaper/Black_CDsII.pdf is the source of this most recent question.
I have read through the paper and still don't find any expanation for the theory.

I doubt that Arnie Nudal and his reps are making things up, but I'd like a little more insight before jumping to any conclusion.

Nobody I know has done this and I don't have the equipment required. Any experience here on AudiogoN???
I have to strongly disagree with Chang here as I suspect he didn't actually audition copies from a Pioneer 739. Therefore he is poo pooing my experiences based SOLELY on the burner he used i.e. all burners are NOT equal!

Chang brings up the point that we do not have access to the master tapes and he is correct. What we do have access to though is a near "edge of the art" $55,000 turntable rig that is only eclipsed by the "best in the world" $70k+ Rockport. That rig has been compared to master tape we use this source as our "reference", then we all would unequivocally state that the burned cd sounds closer in space, harmonic decay, fluidity and overall sound field as compared to the original cd.

The question I have for anyone here is how the hell do you add space, fluidity or additional harmonic decay to a copy with a frequency shift? Many have speculated (including Chang here) that the Pioneer burner is just rolling off the highs or something like that... The problem with those hypothesis is that frequency related colorations never add more space or additional harmonic decay. But guess what? Almost every article ever written about cd sound compared to the master tapes speaks about the loss of the above aforementioned sonic qualities! And since the Pioneer 739 adds these qualities into the copy, I think it is a fair statement to say the copies sound closer to the master tape!

Chang also stated that he had the ability to compare the copy to the original "bit for bit". Unfortunately his statement shows his ignorance of digital. For example: Either the copy or the original could have jitter magnitudes hundreds of times greater than the other, yet both would look identical bit for bit. If you decrease jitter components in the copy, they WILL be audible! Especially if they are large in the original cd as compared to the copy. In a nutshell, it's a hell of a lot more than just bits!
As an owner of the Pioneer PDR-W739, I can say that by utilising the manual digital record level control, the cd copy can have more "volume" or dynamics than the original cd, especially if it is an older cd that has not been remastered. Case in point, I dubbed a copy of Christopher Cross' second cd, "Another Page", which is a very poor recording sonically. The copy sounded much louder and livelier because I increased the level control by 10 dB. On remastered cds, it does not pay to increase the digital level control because the signal will become distorted.