Mating power cords with APL 3910


While waiting for my (Denon) APL 3910 to arrive, I need some help in coming up with a short list of power cords to audition with it. In addition to listing the PCs you liked best with this unit, it would be most helpful if you could provide some specificity. In particular, what sonic and musical virtues are the offspring when the particular PC is mated with the APL 3910? Sonically speaking, which PCs didn't do as well with it? Are there any PCs that mate well (or don't mate well) with digital sources in general?
puremusic
Tvad,
Since the numbers for both the Model 4 and the Model 7 were not multiples of the number of duplexes, I concluded that this was not the result of a single typographical error; but referred to the actual number of elements incorporated into the filter. In my mind, Perry's subjective differences reinforced my interpretation. Let me know how Shunyata explains the numbers.
John
Post removed 
Tvad,
At this stage, I have not made any firm decisions on Hydra 8 or the power cables. I'm trying to do my homework, with the gracious input from you all, to define some options for power filtration and a short list of PCs as a starting point. And then, let my ear-brain-heart-soul determine my choices on the basis of experience.

Sean's suggestion for a parallel line filter at each outlet that will feed the amps sounds good. If it's viable, I may not need an AC conditioner for the amps, just some good power cords for my Jadis and Krell amps. Those power cords will be the subject of another thread. If additional filtration for the amps is necessary, Hydra 2 and 4 are the front runners in my mind. I definitely want filtration for the APL. I will contact Shunyata about the elements in their Venoms. Their answer may determine which Hydra I will settle for the APL. I'm open to trying the Foundation Research LC1 and LC2.

I'm also grateful for all your suggestions for my short list of PCs for the APL: Virtual Dynamics, Mini Khan Plus, AirSine, Wolf Carbon Source, Foundation Research.
Elrod EPS 2 sig was recommended on another website. But I couldn't find its price or website. Does anyone know?
John
The likely reason you note greater "ease" when plugging components into the H8's analog outlets is that there is additional filtering on those outlets and some components may respond more favorably to this. Caelin felt that placing the additional filtration tin the analog section would better isolate that bank from the digital section.

None of the Hydras are in any way current limiting, however the Hydra 2 may in some instances be preferred with high-current products because it does not incorporate a Carling Breaker, which means one less contact point for the AC signal to traverse.

Sean, you are certainly entitled to your opinion and I do enjoy reading most of your informed posts. You have however, made a number of statements related to construction costs, voltage sag, wiring and "design compromises" that are off the mark. I know our pricing model intimately and it is roughly a 5-1 ratio for *all* products. If a part costs a penny, we charge a nickel --and that's considered an antiquated pricing model by todays standards. Every part in the Hydras, from the wiring on to the plated buss systems are custom designed, and then either manufactured by or exclusively for us- even the wiring- excepting the thermally insulated MOV's which are commercially available. You may view some of the parts as over-rated or over-engineered and that is your right, but they are extremely costly to produce--forgetting even the cost or research and design. Our dealer margin is the same as that of speaker and electronics manufacturers. We cannot afford "special price incentives", sales person spiffs or 70%+ overseas margins. This often puts us at a serious disadvantage when competing with "specialty" cable and power companies that offer a great many "breaks" and incentives to dealers.

All Shunyata designs focus on using hand applied, custom made parts and proprietary terminations that reduce contact impedances and present no-limit to the instantaneous current demands of electronics. This is where a lot of money gets spent rather than on isolation transformers, chokes, coils or other reactive devices. Using conventionalyl available power-line caps, a choke, coil or iso-trannies were all considered and rejected because of issues related to reactance, non-linear current flow (such as thermal breakers) and restricted instantaneous current delivery.

If you decide to manufacture your own products and attempt to set up a network of specialty parts vendors, a US based factory, in-house cryogenic facilities and enough staff to run a company, you will likely learn that our retail prices are very reasonable.

Regarding the technical, buss core and wiring issues raised, I'm afraid Caelin would be best equipped to answer those questions, but he long ago gave up trying to answer critical points on the internet. Too often they are loaded with baiting for 'ether-sport' or an agenda, not simple fact finding--he simply does not have the time or inclination. We do not hide any design or construction elements, and anyone that cares to look can decide for themselves whether these make sense to them.

With regards to other comments people made about "marketing fluff and hype", we do very little of either. Forget the reviews, there are many accredited engineers, electronics manufacturers and professionals who understand perfectly what we do and are willing to speak for us. Most of our business is referred from manufacturers and professionals that use the Hydras.

My interests in responding are only related to reading so much opinion--some of it poorly informed, presented in a somewhat pointed way, when much of it runs contrary to what I know to be the truth.

We run an honest business staffed by good people. The products all use solid engineering principles and are purposefully uncomplicated--at a casual glance. Opinions about what might be a better performer or more economical are fine. When serious questions are raised about the integrity of the products or the people that make them however, I feel the need to at least weigh-in.

Regards,

Grant
Shunyata Research
Samuel,
Thank you for clarifying the issue about the analog outlets in Hydra 8, and for providing the information about the Hydra 2. Both explanations are relevant to my decision making.

As you can see from my posts above, the Hydras are my front runners for power line conditioning. Which Hydra, and how many, hopefully, will be determined after some additional clarifications.

Besides the additional filtering on the analog outlets in Hydra 8, are there other differences in the filtering process in the four Hydras? The specifications on Shunyata's website product page list a 4, 7, 10, and 16 element Venom Noise Filters in Hydra 2, 4, 6, and 8, respectively. Do the differences in the number of elements determine differences in the quality of filtration, the type of filtration, or both? These are relevant questions for making an intelligent choice. Specifically, which Hydra would be most appropriate for just the CD player alone? Or, more realistically, what are the sonic trade-offs for a CD player with each of the four Hydras?

As for the amps, I have two mono Jadis JA80 tube amps driving the Wilson Audio Watt/Puppies and one Krell amp driving the Wilson Audio WHOW subwoofer. Since I have 3 dedicated 20 amp AC lines, it will be possible for me to isolate the high current components from the low-current ones, and possibly isolate the right channel from the left one. In view of your information about Hydra 2, it appears that using Hydra 2s on my three amps would be optimal.

I would like to be as close to optimal as possible, but I'm also motivated to be as economic as possible. The bottom line question is: Based on the experience of people within your company, and the feedback from your dealers and clients, what is the sonic cost if I just plug all four components into a Hydra 8 instead of using some combination of the Hydras?

Thank you in advance for your consideration of my questions.
John