Recommend location and type for kitchen speakers


I've not got as exciting a construction project as Albert's but I am remodeling my kitchen later this winter. I would like to have a small system there; maybe an NAD L-40 or Linn Classik. What I am having a hard time getting a grip on is how to locate speakers. Most of the work is done at one end of the kitchen along one wall. I could put in-walls there, but I would only be about 18-24" away from that wall, and the speakers would have to be about 6-8' apart (double window in between). Or they could be bookshelfs at that same location or in-walls in the ceiling, or bookshelfs or in-walls behind me (for that pick-up truck effect!). I'm obviously not going for a serious system here, just some tunes while I work. I would like to get others ideas/experiences/thoughts. Thanks.
128x128swampwalker
How about a nice Vandersteen center island? Maybe look into the Gallo Micro line as they are a bit rolled off in the HF's which might do well in a bright sounding kitchen? They are orange/apple sized balls which would look basically like a couple of track lights, if wall/ceiling mounted on their supplied brackets, and come in various colors. Both passive and active subs (also very tiny) are available as well. On the cheaper and nostalgic side a reburbished/vintage tube radio might be more fun (like a nice colorful Bakelite one).
In-walls at a budget level will not sound as good as independent speakers. In my opinion, you'll get fuzzy muzak. I'm looking at the new Swans M-20 active mini sat/sub system, nice sound for $200 (shown at CES, check av123.com), with intent of hanging the 4" cube speakers from the top of the window frame so they project beyond the wall just a bit. I've found it really helps clarity to have speakers at standing head height, assuming that's how you move around the kitchen. Good luck.
~~~~Ah, You have a two story home. Thats another story!(sorry) If your home was built recently, you may have anywhere from a 7 to 11 inch space above the drywall, and joists spaced 12" to 24" apart. The joists that support a drywall ceiling in a one story home are a minimum of 2"x6". A two story home joists need to be thicker to support the added pounds per square foot load. Depending when the home was built, the span the joist must cover, and what was code at the time, would determine how thick of a floor/ceiling space you have.
~~~~Carefully probe through the drywall in a area that is not noticeable (next to a cabinet). Start with a pointed, small diameter tool. Do not go more than 5/8" in(thickness of fire code drywall). Then with a dull insulated probing tool, could use a piece of solid romex 15" long, or something non conductive and thin, gently push it up until it hits the floor of the second story. Hopefully you won't hit the joist on the first try. If you have a stud finder (not the kind at a bar) you can avoid a joist the first time. You may also tap with your knuckle and listen for a solid/hollow sound. Solid=joist, hollow=space.
~~~~Depending on which way your kitchen is oriented to the joists and interior walls, will determine the difficulty of the wiring. Only use wire rated for in wall use. Since you are not building a reference system, sonic quality of the wire is not a factor.
~~~~If all factors are favorable to ceiling speakers the next factor is which speaker to use. That will determine how you mount and support the speaker. I wouldn't use the drywall only to support the load. You should build a type of solid support inside the space to carry the load and not allow the speaker to vibrate. If an open back unit is selected, you may want to limit the volume of the space by inserting some type of partition and caulk to seal air space. If you have room you may want to install some bookshelf cabinets (wire, support, and trim out surface).
~~~~Is this starting to sound like a walkman would do nicely? Think about these ideas. Hopefully they will give you more options or spark more suggestions from others (other than things like, "Is this guy writing a novel or what!") My typing finger needs a rest. Remember, music soothes the savage beets (I had to!).
Fbi- thanks, I always appreciate humor. I won't have any problem wiring or construction, since the ceiling is coming down and a contractor is doing the whole job. What I'm trying to get a handle on most is speaker placement and code issues re: speaker wire. This will definately NOT be a reference system, but since I work long hours and do most of the cooking, I'd like it to sound nice. Other big issue is relatively small kitchen; if I can good sound out of mini-monitors or in-wall or in-ceiling, that is how I want to go. Has anyone had any experience with speakers behind you? I will probably have some space on the opposite wall to the sink/main counter. Table radio would not be a bad idea if there were any decent radio stations nearby.
~~~~If you want to get the most out of a non reference system, use a graphic equalizer. You can tweak the sound to your liking. Tried many speaker position combinations to find pros and cons. The in front in wall set up 18"-24" away, 6'-8'apart, should give you pronounced bass, exagerated seperation with less front center stage, more of an overhead center effect. Almost like you had a pair of headphones on. Behind you would tend to have less seperation, clarity, and depending on room resonances thin bass or heavy bass. Keep in mind a hidden, inexpensive sub if you aren't satisfied with the bass.

~~~~ The in front bookshelf would give you the ability to adjust toe in/out. Should be secured and also be visually acceptable. Do you have access to(borrow)some small speakers to try front and behind. Sonically, should be the same as in wall(separation/center stage).

~~~~Table radios? Haven't listened to any lately. There are many commercials for the (shh, nobody listen!) Bose wave guide table radio. Try a demo, maybe they can make a decent table radio. Another name that comes to mind is Kloss. Had Zenith, tubed, table radio in the 60's, nice sound!

~~~~ If you go with the on/in wall/ceiling setup, a remote controller is nice. The source could be placed in a cabinet, pantry, or some out of the way location.
~~~~ How far are you from radio stations? I'm in Michigan out in the boonies, use an amplifier on a rabbit eared antenna. Pick up FM from Canada, Ohio, as well as many in state stations. (This is off subject, with this setup on TV, I have watched stations from PA.,OH., CAN., and one day last summer, after a storm, a station from Louisiana came in clear as day for 5 minutes on Ch.3?KDKJ? Didn't write it down. Must have skipped off the atmosphere.)

~~~~Anybody else on wiring? Might have to get my NEC code book out if no replies.

~~~~Shucks, hope I didn't cornfuse you by bending your ear. (Sorry again)