Speakers for Rock

Vader, i'm simply basing my comments on what i've heard and experienced. I also took into account the scenario ( price range and associated components ) that the poster suggests.

None of the Thiel's that i've heard have had any type of "slam" to them whatsoever and have always come across as being noticeably bright sounding. Don't ask me for models as i couldn't tell you. Source and amplification were all of good quality, so i know that this was not a problem.

As a case in point, their latest and greatest "inexpensive" speaker, which was completely redesigned from the ground up, still has these traits. Keep in mind that this speaker, the Thiel 1.6, retails for $2000 and can't even do 50 Hz with ANY type of authority. It starts sloping off like crazy at 100 Hz. It is 10 dB's down at 60 Hz. Since you quoted JA as a "fan" of Thiel's for R&R reproduction, i'll use him too. On page 95 of the September Stereophile, JA stated that the 1.6 lacked bass, needed mid-bass reinforcement, was "treble dominant" and "will not be very forgiving of ancillary components" and pulled twice the current of many other designs. To me, this sounds like a speaker that would be hard to match to other components in terms of tonal balance and power requirements.

The fact that you are getting "slam" out of your Thiel's is probably due in a large part to the amp that you are using to drive them. If you take into account that the person that posted this thread is looking at Rotel & B&K backbone components, i would not expect them to get the same bottom end out of any Thiel that you are experiencing with yours. Couple the lack of bass with an overtly bright treble response that Thiel's tend to produce and the typically horrible digital recordings that most rock & roll bands end up with and you've got the potential for high SPL ear-bleed's with a complete lack of bottom end drive.

I did take notice that the bands that you mentioned did happen to have pretty decent ( not brittle sounding ) recordings though, so if that is all that you listened to, i can see how you might not find this to be a potential problem. Personally, i've got WAY too many digital recordings that don't sound nearly that good or fall into the "good sonics" category to not think about this aspect of system assembly.

I think that i've made my point pretty clear as to why i stated what i did. Obviously, we've got different opinions on this one. As with all of my comments / suggestions, i recommend that the person trust their ears when looking to buy a product. After all, nobody here is going to have the same exact system, acoustics, personal preferences, etc.. As such, all we can do is share our thoughts and experiences, good or bad. From there, each comment is worth only the value that the reader places upon it. Sean
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They're not "audiophile" speakers, and have low significant other acceptance factor, but I can't see doing much better than the larger Tannoy Professional studio monitors: System 15 DMT and 215 DMT (original or MK II).

The MK IIs are still in production, so you can get the relevant stats at: www.tannoy.com (98-101 dB, high power handling, fabulous dynamics, excellent detail and imaging). Work well with low powered valve amps as well as high-powered solid state (I use the latter).

Circa $2K+ used. Rather more for the 215s (though sometimes studios sell 'em cheap).

The adventurous and/or skilful can easily find a used pair of Tannoy 3836s, download the cabinet and crossover plans from the net and come up with a very reasonable facsimile of the System 15.

3836s go for circa $400/pr. Sometimes, though, you find a history of a hard working life as a PA driver means the HF unit needs replacing.

The stacked Klipsch is a good idea, too!

Happy listening.

Joel.

I have owned B&W 801 III run with Krell/Trasparent for 8 years now and love the dynamics and speed they have. I have a larger room with accoustic treatment and use North Creek crossovers which was the weak point of the Matrix series. I play some of the heaviest speed metal and everything else and think they handle everything as equally as I could have imagined. I think the Matrix have a little more snap in them than the Nautilus, but I love the new B&W cabinet's. I am with Sean in that that I have not heard Thiel as a rock speaker, but that could simply be tubes vs. solid state electronics. I like B&W for all types of music and they work great for home theater.

I'm guessing you are shopping in the 1500 or so range. I would have a listen to vandersteen 2's , b&w 601's, proac 2's, and ariel 7&8. The van 2's would be my choice. I think the 801's are one of the best used buys out there - if you can power them (300w ss amp), and have the room for them.

Dagny, I'm on the same page musically. I would chime in too that although B&W and Thiel make some good speakers, they may not be your best choice. Really good rock comes out of such brands only at the high end (CS6 and Krell FPB!). I have heard 801's rock when hooked up to Levinson 33H monoblocks. I would need a second mortgage to pay for that setup. And if you go with Heresy's please get a tube amp because they have made my ears bleed the only times I heard them, which was years ago with Mac solid state. Their main virtue is the ease with which you can damage your hearing. Big deal: you can do that for free at the airport. If you want tuneful bass and no upper mid/low treble emphasis, which exaggerates rock recordings' most common problem, and you don't want to drop 20 grand, you must hear the venerable, warm, slightly wolly but phat, Vandersteen 2ci. Cheap, not hard to drive, nearly indestructible. Should work fine with a Rotel. The limit is that it will not play 120dB. It will play 105, however, and that is plenty loud.

Another good choice in rock speakers that have some pedigree is the Aerial 7 (or 8), which you might find used on this site. They are harder to drive and much more revealing, but with a good high current amp (McCormick DNA, perhaps) they can shake the house, and they will welcome upgrades in your front end better than the 2ci. My point is that you should avoid anything that shouts at you, and some of these "rock speakers" are PA-style screamers. I think you want something that has audiophile qualities but with lots of immediacy and punch. I had Vandies for a long time, hooked up to a Linn front end, and that modest rig had what takes to make a mountain man leave his home.