Thanks Atmasphere. With so may tubes in my system I should probably have gotten a tube tester long ago. I will check possibilities.
Preamp for Aesthetix / Atma-sphere
Hi
I have the Aesthetix Io Eclipse with volume and dual power supplies, Atma-sphere MA-1 monoblocs (140 watts) and Audiokinesis Dream Maker (93 db sensitive) speakers. These are great components. My question is about system synergy, how to make them play together.
I have been running the Io direct to my amps since I first bought the Mk2 version back in 2004. At the time, I had a Krell FPB600, and in that context, it was a blessing, and a great step up from the Krell KAV 250p preamp. I'll never forget my first impression with the Io - it was like going from the wooded hills up into the mountains. There was no going back.
With volume, the Io functions as a preamp. It looks like a preamp. Someone here on A-gon said going direct is best - which I interpreted as: it IS a preamp! So I thought, OK I have a combined phono and preamp - problem fixed. But it wasn't.
From recent testing I have finally become convinced that the Io does benefit from a separarate preamp. Even if clarity and detail is better going direct from the Io to the amps, the punch and "here-ness" of the music is clearly better with a preamp in the chain, at least in my system.
Trouble is, which preamp? I am testing a small solid state Musical Innovation preamp, which helps with the punch but veils the music. An optimal solution might be the Aesthetix Callisto, preferably with dual power - but I don't have the space, and I already have a lot of tubes and tube heat. I have space for one or possibly two boxes.
From what I have heard so far, a solid state might do the job well (in my tube-rich context), however it should not impart any s-state artifacts or reduce the resolution from the Io Eclipse.
The ideal would be to test a few tube and s-state preamps, and then decide. However, this is difficult where I live, so advice is welcome.
My question relates to my own setup of course, but is relevant for everyone with a top phono stage on the one hand and amps on the other. What is best in the middle?
From recent testing I have learned that problems that I thought were related to the speakers, the phono pre, the pickup and so on, were in fact related to the preamp issue. For example, the Dream Makers straight from the Io may sound a bit lazy and washed out in the bass, very clear in mid and treble but not fully embodied. Plugging in the solid state pre, the situation becomes dramatically different, now the speakers are driving, propulsive. Very enjoyable, but some detail is lost and some transistor things added that I don't want.
So I am looking for a solution with most of the plusses, and not much of the minuses. The preamp must be fully balanced with XLR in / out.
-
I have the Aesthetix Io Eclipse with volume and dual power supplies, Atma-sphere MA-1 monoblocs (140 watts) and Audiokinesis Dream Maker (93 db sensitive) speakers. These are great components. My question is about system synergy, how to make them play together.
I have been running the Io direct to my amps since I first bought the Mk2 version back in 2004. At the time, I had a Krell FPB600, and in that context, it was a blessing, and a great step up from the Krell KAV 250p preamp. I'll never forget my first impression with the Io - it was like going from the wooded hills up into the mountains. There was no going back.
With volume, the Io functions as a preamp. It looks like a preamp. Someone here on A-gon said going direct is best - which I interpreted as: it IS a preamp! So I thought, OK I have a combined phono and preamp - problem fixed. But it wasn't.
From recent testing I have finally become convinced that the Io does benefit from a separarate preamp. Even if clarity and detail is better going direct from the Io to the amps, the punch and "here-ness" of the music is clearly better with a preamp in the chain, at least in my system.
Trouble is, which preamp? I am testing a small solid state Musical Innovation preamp, which helps with the punch but veils the music. An optimal solution might be the Aesthetix Callisto, preferably with dual power - but I don't have the space, and I already have a lot of tubes and tube heat. I have space for one or possibly two boxes.
From what I have heard so far, a solid state might do the job well (in my tube-rich context), however it should not impart any s-state artifacts or reduce the resolution from the Io Eclipse.
The ideal would be to test a few tube and s-state preamps, and then decide. However, this is difficult where I live, so advice is welcome.
My question relates to my own setup of course, but is relevant for everyone with a top phono stage on the one hand and amps on the other. What is best in the middle?
From recent testing I have learned that problems that I thought were related to the speakers, the phono pre, the pickup and so on, were in fact related to the preamp issue. For example, the Dream Makers straight from the Io may sound a bit lazy and washed out in the bass, very clear in mid and treble but not fully embodied. Plugging in the solid state pre, the situation becomes dramatically different, now the speakers are driving, propulsive. Very enjoyable, but some detail is lost and some transistor things added that I don't want.
So I am looking for a solution with most of the plusses, and not much of the minuses. The preamp must be fully balanced with XLR in / out.
-
- ...
- 145 posts total
Audiolabyrinth There are not as many variations of Telefunken 12AX7 as some tube brands. Just be sure the bottom of the glass has the diamond embedded in the glass so you know it's not re branded. Second, know your vendor or have provision to test it yourself and be sure the tube is as new or near new. There are lots of tubes floating around that have been sold and resold as each customer filters out the best and passes on the duds. Last, don't take my recommendation as gospel. The correct 12AX7 is what works in THAT device. I've seen variation depending on circuit design and implementation. Could be the Mazda, Mullard or even the Siemens is better in the device you're testing. I gave advice on Aesthetix because I owned it for more than ten years and know pretty well how it responds to various tubes. Your Vincent player is not familiar to me so don't hesitate to test beyond my recommendations to discover what's best. |
06-08-14: Audiolabyrinth I don't recall ever owning a piece of equipment that used the 6Z4 tube. The Radio Museum, http://www.radiomuseum.org/tubes/tube_6z4.html Indicates 6X5 was a successor. Check with the manufacturer to determine if this is a drop in replacement for that circuit. If so, I may have some suggestions. |
06-10-14: O_holter It's been awhile since we did those listening tests but we got the Einstein from Brian Ackerman who was the official importer at the time. Unknown if that was the tube in our test but I remember the CBS was more organic and removed some of the splash in the treble that I had issue with. Could be the caps or circuit have changed since then or perhaps the tube your's came with is an improvement from when I had my sample here. The value of these discussions is to instill the desire to TEST. Don't be afraid to put good quality tubes in there and see what works. Go slow, listen long term, be sure to allow warm up and break in time before making your final judgement. Last, be sure the tubes you're auditioning are genuine and in top condition. It's amazing how some sellers behave. I've seen tubes with as much as 20% transconductance loss with claim as NOS. At 50% loss a tube can be a real duds and some sellers claim there is plenty of life left at that point. If you can, test the tubes yourself. If you cannot, be sure the seller verifies you what you're buying. This can be the make or break detail on your final decision. |
- 145 posts total