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That's my point..."Without Audyssey the stage is less wide and deep." So, if I compared speakers with Audyssey to speakers without Audyssey, all things being equal, the speakers with Audyssey will have a wider and deeper soundstage.

06-17-14: Bo1972
The 929 without my way of XT-32 is huge. You have a much less sharp focus, a more clinical sound, less dynamics, less resolution, les decay.

And in your post earlier today,

I have my own way of measurment. This I won't share.

So what's the point? Isn't the purpose of the forum to share information allowing others to learn. I guess you just want everyone to know what it is like to live in your universe.

I give you a few important tips; You need to use a tripod and you need to work at mm precision. :)

The first few times I did a measurment with Audyssey I thought; I understand the benefit, but I also hear the limitations. So I started to do it differently.

Other people can try it out as well. You are not a mongol, are ya?

The new surround Onkyo receivers are in stereo a lot better than the ones of last year. They also will give stage depth.

In the tests I did between the old and new Onkyo receivers. I only found out that in Multi channel with Audyssey the stage is deeper an wider. And you hear also more decay. They use better capacitors, these give a much more musical sound. The individual focus of instuments and voices with the new ones is also a lot better.

For me personally without Audyssey Pro I never can create the level I have. I will use the 5509 longer. I also will go on for some time with the Integra 80.3.

"The new surround Onkyo receivers are in stereo a lot better than the ones of last year. They also will give stage depth.

In the tests I did between the old and new Onkyo receivers. I only found out that in Multi channel with Audyssey the stage is deeper an wider. And you hear also more decay. They use better capacitors, these give a much more musical sound. The individual focus of instuments and voices with the new ones is also a lot better."

Bo, do you use the amplifier sections of the Onkyo receivers or just the preamp?

I can tell you that I can crush all Marantz and Denon surround and integrated amps with ease.

I can achieve this with using Onkyo surround receivers. The difference are huge. Going back to Marantz and Denon with Monitor Audio you will loose all depth. These are the most common brands in the Netherlands. They also loose in sharpness in focus compared to the Onkyo

I have even proven that I beat a Marantz KI integrated of 3000 dollar with a Onkyo 5010 with Pro. It was superior in every single aspect you Judge an amp for.

I use these Onkyo surround amps also often for people who only play stereo. I can demo that my configuration wins in every single part you Judge a amp for against others.

- stunning 3d stage with a lot of depth and width. Going back to Marantz and Denon it is all gone.

- Better timing and more control compared to Denon and Marantz.

_ a much sharper individual focus.

- even in sound it is better than both brands with Audyssey

- a superior integration in every room based on the acoustics.

- much better articulation of voices and details.

* This is so much fun to do and compare. This is what I said; it is so easy to win it.