Anti-skating- test records vs. ears

Dear Stringreen,
I don't think you understand. If I adjust A/s for the test disc alone, at low-mid VTF (e.g. 1.759g) I can perfectly track the 12db band and (almost) perfectly track the 14db - and get a reasonably clean result on the 15db and 16db bands. ;^)
(Cartridge spec VTF range is 1.7-1.8g btw)

I don't see anything fundamentally wrong with this but it is completely irrelevant because I'm more interested in lower amplitude music signals?

Would you care to describe how your rig performs on those bands with or without A/S AT AVERAGE VTF? (Please tell us what the VTF setting is for your given cart and its max/min spec? It will give us an idea of your capability and show us how a really well set up rig performs?)
Many thanks...

There is no conflict here regarding anti skate. Stringreen doesn't use it, others do. If you use no antiskate you need more vtf, and you also compromise stylus and record wear. But if you prefer that, then fine.

Similarly you can always say you prefer tracking at half or twice the recommended VTF, or with your speakers pointing backwards. That will not change the fact that you are compromising something, while preferring something else.

I don't have a problem with those who don't use antiskate. Only those who deny the existence of the reasons for using it.

Stringreen said, "Mosin....I wonder if you increased the vtf by a bit, if you would come up with the same results."

No, I didn't. I tried that, but the only way to obtain a proper wave for each channel was by adjusting the antiskate.

One thing to consider is that when antiskate is off, it can not only affect tracking because of lateral pull, but when using a unipivot arm, it is possible for it to affect azimuth. My case may have been exasperated by that.

John Gordon....the reason I don't use anti-skate is because it sounds better with none...that and that alone is the reason. I don't deny the force is with you. Re VTF....every cartridge is built a bit differently, even with the most skilled hands...there are variables. Every cartridge has a tracking force that is optimum for that particular cartridge. By saying a cartridge is tracking at 2.135 grms makes no sense whatsoever. I don't know what my cartridge tracks at...I know its about 2 grams or so. What I do is listen. I adjust the vtf, and test it while moving the the back end of the arm up and down...an arduous, torturous, days work. When I'm done, I am satisfied that that is the best I can get it. I have a VPI 3D arm, use a Mint protractor, a Fozgometer, and lots of concentration.

Stringreen ...I can tell you that it works better without. I don't care if you or anyone else uses a/s...I can tell you that I don't.

the reason I don't use anti-skate is because it sounds better with none...that and that alone is the reason

Your VPI tonearm generates antiskate.
I have owned two VPI tonearms in the past and they both applied AS through the wire design.
You don't need to take my word on it. Read your VPI tonearm manual.
Taken from the manual.

As mentioned earlier, the arm wire applies the anti-skating force. The degree of force applied
can be adjusted as explained below.
To increase or decrease the amount of anti-skating force applied, simply unplug the Lemo
connector and twist it in the direction you want the force applied.
For example, to increase anti-skating force give the connector a counterclockwise twist,
unwinding the coiled wire. Likewise, to decrease the force, give the connector a clockwise
twist. Remember, the Lemo connector can only be "adjusted" in increments of whole turns.
If it is not, its key will not line up with the groove in the receptacle.