DarTZeel Preamp

Just when it appears Mr. Tinn that your posts cannot get any more illogical - you outdo yourself yet again.

First, lets look at the FACTS about this thread:

1. The ORIGINAL poster, Ubglub, asked a specific question about experiences with the DarZeel PREAMP (NOT the amplifier).

2. Hooper, NOT me, originally led the post astray by taking the opportunity, in response to a specific post about the Dart PREAMP, to bring up Jeff's review of the AMPLIFIER and called it "utterly ridiculous"! (why he felt he needed to do that when the question was about the PREamp - I could not figure out).

3. So, knowing Hooper is a nice guy, I simply asked Hooper why he claimed Jeff's review was "utterly ridiculous" and in his next post he claimed it was because, in his reasoning, Jeff was "irresponsible" by mismatching the Dart to the Wilsons claiming it wasn't powerful enough to drive the Wilsons.

4. I challenged Hooper's claim that the Dart was not powerful enough to drive the Wilsons. In FACT, JTinn himself later acknowledged the Dart WAS powerful enough to drive the Wilsons - thus giving credence to my challenge of Andy's reasoning in calling Jeff "irresponsible" and his review "utterly ridiculous." GO BACK AND READ MY AND HOOPERS DIALOGUE! AT THIS POINT THE INTERACTION WAS CIVIL, PLEASANT AND WE WERE HAVING NO PROBLEMS. REMEMBER, I DID NOT DO ANYTHING BUT CHALLENGE A CLAIM THAT MY FELLOW COLLEAGUE WAS "IRRESPONSIBLE" AND THAT HIS OPINION WAS "UTTERLY RIDICULOUS." HOOPER AND I WERE FINE AT THAT POINT AND DONE WITH THE INTERACTION AND THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN THE END OF IT.

5. Enter Mr. Tinn and his completely unprofessional post calling Jeff and Marc biased and Jeff "slimy" and "an out and out liar" and "unprofessional" and then condemning Soundstage. SO EVERYONE, ASK YOURSELF THIS: IF HOOPER AND I WERE DONE AND EVERYTHING WAS CIVIL PRIOR TO THAT POINT, WHEN DID ALL THAT CHANGE AND WHO HIJACKED THE THREAD???

IN ADDITION, ASK YOURSELF WHO HAS BEEN UNPROFESSIONAL, WHO HAS SOMETHING TO GAIN FROM INSULTING THE DARTZEEL REVIEW IN SOUNDSTAGE AND WHO HAS DONE THE NAME CALLING?

I stuck to the facts of the thread, to Jtinn's actual language from the thread and to the Owner's Manual from his product to show where the real bias was and who had the real agenda. People responded to challenge Jtinn and his close friend Mike LaVigne even said he did NOT agree with JTinn's categorization of Jeff and Marc or their motives and that JTinn made "assinine assertions!" If his good friend even thought his bashing of Marc and Jeff was wrong and his assertions assinine, then either my challenge to Mr. Tinn's post was justifed or I guess then Mike TOO has an agenda to destroy Mr. Tinn.

However, here is Mr. Tinn claiming I hijacked the thread and that HE is the victim. LOL!! Ya gotta love Mr. Tinn's logic!

In closing, Mr. Tinn, may I suggest that if you are going to commit something to writing in a thread (and unjustifiably insult and defame a reveiwer and a magazine) or carry a product with an Owner's Manual that contradicts your claims, you may want to think twice before you post and know your product a little better since all I have done is point out what you and the Manual have said. Period!

"IN ADDITION, ASK YOURSELF WHO HAS BEEN UNPROFESSIONAL, WHO HAS SOMETHING TO GAIN FROM INSULTING...."

JTinn be insulting...? Nah, couldn't be...

Just do a search...this thread ain't an isolated incident.

Pointing out a paragraph in an owners manual as proof that there is no break in required, could be seen as a cover story by Jeff Fritz to justify his lack of effort in doing the review properly.
The truth will be hear when ... was the owners manual provided with the amp physically, or was it looked at after the review by download as Jtinn suggests?

Frank:

Just to clarify: My "utterly ridiculous" comment was tied to a previous phrase in which I said that DartTZeel was starting to get some very good press in the States, the lukewarm "Soundstage" review excepted. And, while I may have started this whole thing by my comment about the review (which, as you know, I gentlemanly retracted), I claim no responsibilty for the ugly and nasty turn it has taken since. JTinn and others may respond to your post, and then you'll likely feel compelled to respond to his/theirs. At some point, someone has to let it go. It's getting increasingly bitter and vitriolic, and it's not helping anyone, especially the poor original poster who just wanted opinions about the preamp. And, as much as you wanted to summarize the chain of events, I really don't like the fact that my "mistake" is being brought up over and over. I already feel like enough of a jerk, and this is just making me feel worse. As I said, someone has to let this mess go eventually. It's already spun far enough out of control. Just my OPINION.

Hooper, I have one problem with your post. Try to let go of your allegiance to Tinn and take an unbiased look at my posts. NEVER have I said YOU caused it to get ugly. In fact I said JUST the opposite - that you and I were civil and had resolved the issue before Tinn got ugly.

Next, NEVER have I said anything ugly about DartZeel or you. You are implying here that I AM causing your remarks to be repeated over and over. DO YOU REALLY BELIEVE THAT? If Tinn would simply admit (like you did about your original post, and like Mike does he says he does NOT agree with Tinn's characterization of Jeff and Marc and their motives) that he wrongly bashed and unprofessionally maligned a reviewer and his review THAT WAS NOT NEGATIVE, then this WHOLE thing would have ended. If Tinn keeps throwing out insults and refusing to be accountable for his written word and his slanderous comments and he keeps posting claiming that I HIJACKED this thread, then I have no choice but to defend myself by simply listing the FACTS AGAIN in hopes that objective minds will see that Jeff didn't do what he accuses him of, why Tinn bashed him and Soundstage and who OBVIOUSLY hijacked this thread.

It's funny how JTinn maligns me and my job by smugly asking don't I have anything better to do. Yet another double standard by Mr. Tinn!!! Then, how is it that Mike LaVigne isn't guilty of the same thing when posting his long posts? Mike, as a general manager of an Auto Dealership is even busier than I am. Also, why is Mike posting here at all? Because JTinn is his friend and he is trying to come to his aid - WELL THAT IS ALL I WAS TRYING TO DO WHEN MY COLLEAGUE WAS SO UNJUSTLY ACCUSED OF BEING A LIAR, BEING SLIMY AND BEING UNPROFESSIONAL! JTinn has made MANY defamatory and unsupported allegations and comments about Jeff in this thread. I have NOT done anything but point out Mr. Tinn's fallacious logic using his own words - something he obviously has no tolerance for as evidenced by his refusal to either admit (i) that he was wrong; or (ii) that you and Mike are also biased an non-credible for the same reasons he used to judge Marc and Jeff. He simply will not be accountable for those statements and his double standard attacks.

So, AGAIN, who could have NOT started this ugliness in the first place - Mr. Tinn. Similarly, who could have ended it with class and integrity by being a man and admitting his mistake? Tinn. Who continues to hurl insults and personal attacks instead of addressing his own words? Tinn.

Do the math Andrew. If you can be a man and admit a mistake, if Mike can admit that Tinn was wrong in his characterization of Jeff and Marc and their motives - ask yourself who is the ONLY person who cannot do the same thing? Ask yourself who is REALLY causing this thing to drag on? Ask yourself who REALLY hijacked this thread! I think you know the answer as does anyone who objectively reads this thread.

So, if there are no more insults or attacks leveled by Tinn and his group, there will be no more responses.

PS - the reason that JTinn and Mike have stated that some of their posts have not been allowed should be illustrative. The reason all my posts are getting through is that I am sticking to a debate of the FACTS and the words used on the thread. If JTinn's post calling Jeff "slimy" and "an out and out liar" made it through, can you IMAGINE how vituperative and venemous or unrelated to the issue at hand those posts must have been for Audiogon to prohibit them?