Jadis Orchestra Reference SE and DA-50 Integrateds

Hello, Paul. Glad to hear that Richard is doing well. From all accounts, he is a really good person.

If you have little need for ultimate bass extension, but prize midrange "rightness" over absolutely all else, the JJ Blue Glass E34L tube is for you. In my experience, no tube will provide you with better clarity, openness, imaging, and "sunny disposition", while not sounding harsh, overly forward, brittle, or muddled. I think the treble is also quite good. You do take somewhat of a step back in terms of absolute power (2 clicks on the JOR's volume knob), and the loss of bass impact is definite. You can pick up a quad of these tubes for about $65, so being just over $15/tube, they definitely meet your budget. After speaking with Denis, and going over this sonic priorities, we chose these tubes, and I was not quite prepared for the improvement they yielded.

If the loss of power and bass is unacceptable, the JJ KT88 are the ones we are speaking of. They provide ultimately less absolute bass extension, but apparent bass impact will seem to rise (and not subtly), as the mid/upper bass is more pronounced, and most people in my experience seem to equate mid/upper bass with what they think is actually low bass. You will lose that wonderful midrange by a step or two, but it still would be a real upgrade over the Ei KT90. Prices are much higher than the E34L, about $150/quad or so, which still easily falls within your budget.

I want to make sure no one takes me as not being a fan of the Ei KT90. The tubes are the most rugged I have encountered, and for those who want no one area to stick out, they do seem to provide that. Also, prices have come down in recent years, as they spiked sharply after the 1998 NATO bombing of the factory in the former Yugoslavia. Still, while liking the JOR a lot with these tubes, I ended up loving it when I tried the others.

Incidentally, Denis, if you are still here, what type of difference did the Mullard 12AX7 provide you over the Ei? In my DA30 over the summer, I originally had a pair of National, and the Ei were a step up. Then, I tried a pair of Mullard Blackburns, and that also yielded some tangible improvements over the Ei, with no drawbacks that I could detect. Clarity, detail, bass response all improved, along with adding more liquidity and a relaxed nature. I'm curious if the Mullards also gave you the same improvement as I heard over the Ei.

Joe, I'm sold on the EL34's. Can you provide a link or know of a seller that can help me?
Email me if you care.
Also can you help me out with replacing the 4 6992's in my Cayin 17 cdp.
I'm really looking forward to the EL34's.
Should be just the thing for reproducing my classical music.

As an update, I have been tube rolling in the DA60 to outstanding effect!

Currently, I am burning in an octet of JJ Blue Glass KT88, and all I can say is "WOW"! The improvement over the Sovtek 6550 is simply amazing. Every aspect of the sound from bottom to top has improved substantially. The DA60 makes some serious bass with the Coincidents. Funny, in another thread, someone made the statement that a Jadis integrated lacks slam and falls apart when the music gets going. Oh, yea?!? This must be heard to be believed. But, what makes this a Jadis is the sweet, romantic sound, that you can simply listen to all day without fatigue.

The mids seem so right that I wonder if I can improve upon them. But, try I will - I am awaiting an octet of the newly released JJ KT77 tubes, which are a premium EL34 type tube. Hopefully, I will be able to install them this weekend, and be able to compare them to the KT88. I expect a downgrade in the low frequencies, and potentially some power (which the DA60 has oodles to spare), but am anxious to hear how the mids of this new tube sound.

Incidentally, I have also wrought some very real improvement by installing Sylvania 5751 tubes in place of the Mullard Blackburn 12AX7. THAT was worth it.

Hey Joe, you have me salivating. Maybe I should just buy your DA30 and quit dilly dallying.

Incidentally, CJ just informed me that I shouldn't be using my Sylvania 3-mica black plate 5751s in place of the 12AX7s in my MV55. They said "the circuit is optimized for 12AX7" and wouldn't tell me anything more than that. In a way, I wonder if it really matters...but now they have me worried. What can it hurt?? Anyway, thought I would mention it. Arthur

Arthur, thank you for your perspective!

All I can say is that "if it sounds right, it is right." And, in my case, these 5751 definitely sound right. It's funny because I bought them from a local guy, and he has thousands of tubes, and didn't seem as if he felt they were anything special. But, I guess he's never really spent a lot of time with the 5751. I told him I was trying them based on the claims of some that a 5751 can outdo a 12AX7, which he chortled at. He said, "You should try a good 12AX7." When I told him I had the Mullards, he said, "Well, I guess you can always have these as a spare or sell them or whatever..." Anyhow, they were not better in every area (weak bass) initially, but after about 3 hours, it was pretty clear they weren't ever coming out.

Do you have the same feelings in your CJ regarding the 5751? If so, just do what you know is right.

Regarding the DA30, I'm wondering just how modified it is? I believe I am going to relist it at a lower price, this week, as it seems as if a going through by Avi Brand might improve it significantly as was the case of my DA60. I wasn't sure what the actual market value of it was, as you see SO few of them come up, but I tried to scale it on what an Orchestra/JOR trades for. After the past couple of days, I'm not sure I could sell it in good conscience at what I listed it for. I want to discuss it with Avi to see if I could get a ballpark on what he would be interested in getting it together for the new owner for.