Transformer based passives vs passive stepladder

So, Clio, you also find too much gain in some sources, such as CD using the Electra? I find that pseudo passives such as the active First Sound Paramount I use have the same issue. Usually is fine, with LP or Phono preamp through (low gain) but when it comes to CDP or other sources, sometimes it can get loud too fast. I wonder if this is the implementation of a preamp with OA2 tubes paired with 6922 or something else. The fact is that I have come to the realization that I have plenty of gain and that it can distort the original way things were recorded. I also have a pair of EVS nude Ultimate Attenuators and it does the job of attenuating the gain as transparently as possible, but how Atmasphere has already stated, sometimes, pursuying the last bit of purity sometimes has more drawbacks than benefits....

Nevertheless, I still dream of have one less stage, if possible in the signal chain.

Has anyone heard the SILVER ROCKS somewhere?

Paul K

Paul K - Funny, the Joule uses OA2 tubes as well, along with a pair of 6EM7 in the power supply. The signal path has a 5751 and 6350 for the mu follower. It is a pretty low gain preamp, but my amp is 30db and .8V sensitivity. I also have no issue with the phono preamp. Perhaps the EVS is the best solution for me at the moment, but I'm pretty curious at what my custom K&K will do.

The Silver Rock passives look nice, but they're out of my price range.

Based on my experience I'm inclined to believe Atmasphere regarding the role interconnects play in a passive configuration, as well as the inevitable artifacts generated by most active line stages. I have a Bent Noh with S&B TX-102 trannies, and while it is a very smooth and uncoloured device, I've never gotten it to work really well with any of the amps I've had. By "really well" I mean combining that smoothness and even-handed midrange frequency response with a sense of dynamic life, air, microdetail and enough bass extension. In contrast, the mid-priced tube line stages I have (Canary and Audion) give the music back its life and dynamics, but at the expense of some frequency colourations - and the level of detail is very dependent on the tubes in use.

Up to that point its a fairly even tradeoff of tastes - you pays your money and you takes your choice. However, a really good line stage like the Tom Evans Vibe/Pulse shows up both the passive and the tube units very convincngly, providing the best of each camp with lots of detail, transparency and musicality, while inflicting very few colorations on the sound. I have no doubt higher end tube units than mine would show a similar level of performance.

Passives for me are renewed evidence of the TANSTAAFL principle - "There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch".

Gliderguider,

Do you know which version of the S&B Transformers your Bent has in it? The mkI & mkIII versions are supposed to be noticably superior to the mkII.

I really haven't noticed any of the problems you mention going from my phono pre or dac to my Art Audio PX-25 or Welborne DRD 300B amps.

But, I am very, very, interested in Atma-Sphere's fully differential MA-3 preamp with built-in phono stage.

I do believe mine has the Mk II trannies. I think whether there are problems or not is heavily system dependent, but I get the impression that synergy problems are more widespread than gets reported. In my local high-end ecosystem everyone who has tried separate passives of either type has ultimately gone away from them due to problems with dynamics, bass/treble rolloffs and lack of detail. Off the top of my head that would be about six people.

The one fellow who is happily using one has an integrated with a passive volume control. This hints at the role of downstream interconnects in the picture. I have a stepped attenuator on my Audion PX25, but that amp sounds much better with an active line stage driving it. This points to the role the source component's capability plays, since the probable culprit is the source's output impedance.

That adds up to too many variables for this old urban cowboy. I'm much more inclined to put a very good active in the system and stop worrying about it.