Sonic difference between the CAT JL2 Sig & CAT JL3

Wow, I am envious. The big and beautiful Avalons. Maybe I can bring the amps and aesthetix preamp and you bring the speakers and we can have quite a concert. 8-)

As I recall from following the Avalons over the years, the Ascent and then later the Eidolons needed powerful amps, typically reported ss amps, to really come to their full potential. But with the big Avalons, don't these have the subwoofers with accompanying sub amps? If so, these speakers could be much easier to drive than their smaller sibblings. None of the Avalons have any nasty dips in their impedance curves which makes it equally nice. This opens the door for consideration for either the JL-3s or a pair of JL-2s.

I have wanted to hear a head-to-head of the two CAT amps but logistics have just not allowed it .... yet. Maybe I will get the chance this year. But in this case, it would be the JL-3 sig vs JL-2 std models which both have the same capacitor types. Here it would come down to the potential of greater dynamic contrasts, ease, perhaps low-end control, etc., rather than much if at all any tonality or resolution differences.

The JL-2 Sig has the latest cap changes as does the JL-3 Sig MK II. These model suffixes get to be a little complicated! I have held off with the MK II update only because of the concern of shipping the amps back to CAT. This is almost something I would deliver myself to avoid the potential of damage. And for now, what the JL-3 sigs do for me leaves me little wanting for more tweaking to them other than getting the updated circuitry to better handle tube failures. And a CAT dealer can do this with some parts changes. I understand this latter work is standard to all CAT amps delivered now.

In my smallish room, 13x18x7.5, the single JL-2 would be plenty to bring happiness with the SoundLab A1s. But I bought the JL-3s with the intent of them being my last amp. I have bigger and greater plans for a larger room in the future. And I have felt that it would most likely only be Avalons that would displace the SoundLabs from my system. So I bought the JL-3 with all this in mind rather than to my specific needs at the moment.

With the money you are looking to spend, and having premier speakers in this wonderfully sized room, you need to find a way to hear these amps for yourself. A single JL-2 might be a good start if cost is an issue. But ideally, you will want one amp per speaker to truly get the separation and subtle details that I have no doubt your speakers are capable of. And then it comes down to a pair of JL-3s driven full range or a pair of JL-2's biamped. There's just no way to know how the outcome would be unless you tried it right then and there. I would love to have the opportunity to hear this. Either way, it's the same number of tubes so plan on listening to your music in summer clothes. 8-)

John

The current top of the line model, the Sentinel, has built in bass amplification, but the Osiris does not. A description of the Osiris can be found online.

John: Just you wait! You haven't heard the system :-)

Brian

Have any of you tried VTL 750's or 450's in this wonderful system? I am curious how these amps stack against the CAT's and essentially what are the differences? I have heard the 750's with Sound Labs and Kharma's with excellent results.

thanks. Louis

Brian, I spoke with Lucien (PR for Avalon) and he informed me that he had heard the Osiris driven effectively (not high spl's) by the twenty something watt Audio Note Ongaku.
The speakers are a very benign load. I should have spoke with Lucien before pouring through all the agon posts regarding the Osiris. I mistakenly thought the Osiris was a difficult load and rushed to buy something that could drive it so it could be positioned properly when delivered.
I bought a pair of Levinson 436's for sale on agon. This is the first ss amp I have used in over twenty years and not a very good one. After I spoke with Lucien I yanked the Levinson's and put the Manley 350's in. They drove the Osiris with much greater authority than the megawatt Levinson's. They bettered them in all parameters but especially in the bass (that really surprised me). I am trying to put my last system together and so far I have the speakers and cabling (John when you hear the Stealth Indras and Dreams you will know you have found your last set of cables, they are ORGANIC!). I will be trying the Nuforce 9 SE's in about a week. They come with a thirty day money back guarantee so why not. ultraaudio.com has just reviewed them check it out. They might be good summertime amps. If these 7.5 pound monos turn out to be as good as claimed they may save me twenty grand and massive electric bills. By the way they recommend Stealth cables for them. I'll post again when I hear them. If they are not world beaters I will try to pick up a JL2 Sig on agon. I think our sonic tastes are similar John. And since you have done the research I'll probably look for a used Aesthetix Callisto down the road (when funds permit).
I only use cd's (I am confident they will surpass lp's before I die). Louis, I have used several different VTL amps during the last decade and while they are good values, I don't think they will fare well against the CAT's and others. Thank you all for chiming in and I'll keep you posted on my progress. John thanks for the email and let me know how the Stealth audition goes.

Bart

Wow, roaming around on the Avalon site makes me feel like a kid in a candy store. These things are works of art.

Bart, there might be some value to further research the VTL 750 amps. Albert Porter has had these for a year or so, and after much tube experimentation, he is very excited with their performance. He uses two pairs in his system. And he is a heck of a nice guy here so he shuold be able to give you some insights as to pros/cons of these amps. I have pestered him to try a pair of JL-2s in his system just to get an idea of the CAT vs. VTL sound but getting a pair of CATs is not an easy task and again, he really likes the VTLs.

And concerning the Callisto, I love this thing. But it took me a year, and for the Io as well, to go through a lot of tube trials to really get this thing to perform like nobody's business. And a quick look under the hood by Steve Huntley of GNSC here in MN shows there is much to be improved in these units with significant parts updates, wiring changes, etc., that far exceeds their "Signature" updates. But before you lock yourself too tight on the Aesthetix train, I hope you can try other models in your system vs. the UII.

As for the Stealth, when the Io and Manley Ref DAC return from their GNSC updates, and the JL-3s back from their mods, I will be ready to try some of the Stealth Dream/Indra vs the Dominus throughout the system. I will certainly let you know how that all works out.

John