Aria phono preamp - Mike Elliot blog

Yes,

Anticipating production to commence at the end of first quarter, 2005.

I've been following this. With all due respect, it seems like the guy is winging, it. I mean its good to get the detailed description of the design process, but reading the thing gives me the impression that its being done on-the-fly. Also, its going to be very expensive and I know he always says its cheap given the parts used, but even so, I tend to disagree given the description.

I mean, look at the volume control discussion, he outsourced the relay control logic and now is wondering whether the clicking noise of the relays will be a distraction...of course they click! (not clicking in the audio circuit but physcial noise from the case- you can hear the relays connect and disconnect) I mean I could have told him that before he spent all that $$ to have the board designed. And given the "sound comes first" approach, it is odd that he is saying that he will discard the relay vol control if its clicking noise is bothersome even if it sounds better than the switched attenuator. Plus, you can easily do a remote for the relays.

I've had his stuff, Counterpoint and the upgrades, everthing sounded great, but the newer items/ upgrades are very expensive.

So you asked what do people think? I think that its 3 years behind schedule (prob. wont see it till 2008), sounds interesting, and will not be cheap. But the guy does good work, so looking fwd to see what happens. I would not put a deposit on the thing...put the money in the bank/ invest it and by the time it is done you would have made enough for a substantial discount.

I wonder what people think about the amps that have been out for awhile now.

Great comments.

Southpark, i thought the noise was in the circuit.

I wasn't going to buy one since i don't have my table anymore. I've had a bunch of counterpoint stuff and was just interested in his process.

I have followed the Aria WV thread and have been quite impressed with the level of detail he has shared on his findings. And I was so impressed that I made a deposit for this unit in Dec 2004.

With all due respect, it seems like the guy is winging, it.

With all due respect, this is an incredibly irresponsible statement. Yes, like he was winging it 15-20 years ago with the SA9/SA11. Even the heavily-biased ARC fanatics had to concede that this was the superior preamp. And look at what they still sell for today vs. the ARC and CJ products of that time. Only the SP-10 has held onto any following.

but reading the thing gives me the impression that its being done on-the-fly

Interesting - nearly all engineering activities are done on the fly given a good starting design. And in this case Michael Elliot had such...........the SA9/SA11! As one stage is refined, it tends to expose opportunities to refine existing stages. The result is an iterative process. And this is clearly what is happening with the WV.

I see this as an effort to refine the product and try every available part before rushing a product to market. It sure beats suddenly having an obsolete product in 6 months due to a Mk II version with a capacitor "upgrade" that costs the consumer an added $500-1000 more for $50 in capacitors. And with such a process comes the need to ship the piece back and forth, risking damage, and having the music system down for 2 weeks.

And just as so many companies are throwing in the latest boutique capacitors, and jacking up the cost accordingly, Mr. Elliot has actually take the time to evaluate many of these parts.....and not for his desired coloration but rather, for neutrality. This is covered here.

I mean, look at the volume control discussion, he outsourced the relay control logic and now is wondering whether the clicking noise of the relays will be a distraction...of course they click! (not clicking in the audio circuit but physcial noise from the case- you can hear the relays connect and disconnect) I mean I could have told him that before he spent all that $$ to have the board designed.

Once again, it can be done like everybody else .... and suffer the same sonic degradations ......... or an innovative engineer can step up to the plate and make an effort to implement a new solution. Jumping to conclusions without knowing the facts does not make a lot of sense. Clearly even he was quite impressed with the outcome but is looking for ways to deal with the "clicks".

And given the "sound comes first" approach, it is odd that he is saying that he will discard the relay vol control if its clicking noise is bothersome even if it sounds better than the switched attenuator.

I don't find it odd at all. He clearly states that if he finds the sound annoying, he will not push this onto his customer.......quite different than the "take-it-or-leave-it" philosophy. And what do you suspect Mr. Elliot will do if he ultimately discards the relay volume control? My bet is that he will end up with a solution that still betters the typical resistive volume control network so prevalent in many products out there.

Plus, you can easily do a remote for the relays.

It sounds like you would be a great asset to the WV design team. I suggest you contact Mr. Elliot for an employment application.

I would not put a deposit on the thing...put the money in the bank/ invest it and by the time it is done you would have made enough for a substantial discount.

Well, let's do the numbers. For a price of $7200 in Dec 2004, a typical credit union rate of 3%, for 2005, 2006 and even all of 2007, the $7200 becomes $7867....or for a 5% rate, $8335. If you think this is a gamble, so is every deposit into a 401k account. Clearly enough of Mr. Elliot's customers know the potential here and have given him their support to do an all-out-assault design here.

And what exactly is the substantial discount? The Aria website clearly states the WV will likely sell for $12k upon completion.

Just look at the insane cost of line stages. The ARC Ref2 and Ref3 at $10k.........the top phono stage is going to cost you another $7k....and another power cable and another $3-4k in an IC to retrieve the capability of the two. The same can be said for any pairing of top-tier line and phono stages.

As an owner of the Aesthetix Callisto (2 years) and Io (4 years), I have found this combination to be unbeatable. But all the extra chassis and cabling has been somewhat of a hassle. I welcome the simplicity of the WV. And I will not be surprised if it far exceeds many of these $20k 2-piece preamps. In fact, I am banking on it!

Jafox,

Whoa there big boy! Just giving my impressions of the blog. I did not mean to disrepect the guy, heck I've owned and liked his stuff. It just seemed to me that he did not have the design very far along when he started the blog and that he is kind of doing it as he goes. Now this doesn't mean the end result will be bad, nor does it mean that the price is too high, nor does it mean to imply that no one else does this. And I said I appreciated his candor with letting us in on the design process.

I'm just giving my impression and that's all I can do. I wouldn't want to have paid the guy to design something as I'd rather spend for a finished product, but others of course trust the guy for something great (for good reason) so have apparently funded the development for a fixed price ...that's certainly fine too. I'm sure it will be a nice product (and expensive) when it comes out in a year or three.

Jafox,

I agree with your words! And I bet that Mr. Elliott will do a great job for our hearing! Mr. Elliott is a genius and in the past with every products he has done(from the simple SA 1000 to more complicated and sophisticated SA 11 or SA 9) he proved to be a guru in the hi-fi, hi-end word! And the others like AR and similar have only to learn from great person like Mike!
Mike.. God bless you and your job!