BAT Preamps, why such polarized opposite opinions?

Tom,

I don't think that Saki70 is asking why BAT made an integrated amp, but why they choose to use tube pre/ SS amp design, as opposed to say a full SS or full tube design. Many American designers, such as Cary, VAC, McIntosh, ARC, etc, as well as many foriegn designers have designed full tube integrated amps, pre and amp sections.

I'm also curious as to why BAT hasn't taken a swing at this market, especially considering how successful their VK-300x is. My guess would be that maybe their tube amps run too hot to share a chassis with a preamp section.

Cheers,
John

Hi John,

Thanks John, you're right. I didn't read Saki70's post thoroughly.

Again, my guess would be one of all marketing decisions. I think BAT wanted the 300x to be able to drive a large majority of speakers available today. For their target market ... I would think BAT wanted it to come in at a certain price, size/weight, as you pointed out, not to generate too much heat, and to achieve a certain level of sonic performance.
I guess BAT felt the design they came up with was the best way for them to accomplish their sonic and marketing goals.

Happy holidays,
Tom

Maybe worthwhile to know that BAT actually had - via their integrated amp catered for 3 markets:

1. the solid state mkt - vk 300
2. the tube hybrid mkt - vk 300x
3. the super-tube mkt - vk 300xse (not my cup of tea)

hence its already catering to the INTEGRATED MKT via 3 different integrated models :)

my personal opinion is that the vk300x(which i own) is fun to listen to. it has the best of SS/tube in one EXCEPT its not holographic enough...other than that, it is so so so so ...nice..... :)

I have owned and modified a BAT preamp. It started out as a VK-5, then 5I, then 5 SE. Then I modified the 5 SE.

I upgraded the coupling caps, the Vishay resistors to the newer Z foil, and replaced some of the power resistors with Shinkoa tantalum.

My replacement caps are fuller sounding oil types, bypassed with copper foil teflon caps. These were best out of many, almost every cap out there except for the V-cap, which I did not try (approx. $1000.00 for a set).

All the last mods together made about as much difference as going from a decent powercord to an excellent one.

The stock oil caps were so good, that I almost put them back in !

One point I am trying to make is that I don't see anything in the BAT preamp that would make it "dark or veiled sounding".

They are Stereophile Class A, and as they state in their Magazine: Class A sound can only be achieved with the right ancillary components.

I would definetly include cables, especially power in these "components".

This would of course apply to other excellent preamps like VAC, ARC, etc., and the other components.

This is system building, and system Synergy.

Good luck !!

Lot's of comments for and against BAT being slow, thick, veiled and others replies to this.

I have owned BAT amps and preamps (3iX and VK 60's running in mono). At the very same time I owned Krell gear and Levinson gear and had a variety of speakers - Wilson (Duettes and 5.1s), Thiel (2.2s) and Von Schweikert (4 jrs.). I also owned various front ends in conjunction with this equipment - ranging from Audio Aero Capitole (very warm and sweet sounding), EMM Labs, DCS stack, Esoteric, Wadia and Resolution Audio. Other preamps with this equipment over time were a Cary pre, JR Capri pre, and Calypso (one of my all time favorite components).

If you listen to Conrad Johnson and then switch out to BAT, you will think the BAT is cooler, faster and leaner. If you switch from Krell you will feel that the BAT equipment is warmer, slower and richer.

If you walk into a room with BAT playing and don't have a strong reference point, you are not likely to call the BAT either too rich or too lean, too warm or too cold, too fast or too slow.

Typically, with the level of equipment we are talking about the differences are most apparent in side-by-side testing and like icecream, we all have our favorite flavors. Some people will say a good Vanilla icecream is bland - not recognizing the unique and special characteristics of good quality, though somewhat subtle vanilla beans. Others will say butter pecan is just too darn sweet and others will say sherberts don't deliver that creamy texture they seek.

So in the end, BAT won't be too warm, slow or veiled for most people (however those that crave the polar opposite will have these complaints). BAT won't be too detailed, dry and lean to most people (but those that crave a super warm and syrupy sound may think so).