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Silky and soft highs: product of coloration?

Hi folks this is a bit controversial topic. I know some amplifiers (and some very expensive ones too!) have a very silky and soft presentation of the (upper) treble. I'm wondering if this silky presentation can be considered as a hallmark of quality for amplifiers or rather a sort of coloration that makes the upper treble soft and "pretty". In my opinion I can divide amplifiers in two groups: one group (the largest) with "ordinary" treble response (not very pretty) and the other group that consists of only a handful of amplifiers (both solid state and tube) with a refined and silky treble. The contenders within this last group are alas too expensive for mere mortals. This brings me to another question: is such a refined and silky treble only to be had with megabuck amplifiers?
I consider the Anne-Sophie Mutter recording "Carmen Fantasie" as the ultimate test recording for treble sweetness. If the amplifier sounds just "ordinary" with this recording (especially where the violin plays in the upper register) then the amplifier is not "refined" enough.

Chris
dazzdax
dazzdax OP
599 posts
 
Dave, with "soft" I don't mean low level audibility but "not scratchy or edgy". Silky is about grainless and smooth sound.
Nil, I know violins can sound aggressive in real life, but there is always this "energy" and bloom even with aggressive playing. Not thin, scratchy or threadbare "noise".

Chris
dgarretson
2,594 posts
 
Live performances in acoustically uncontrolled settings rarely provides a good reference point for comparison to well-miked studio recordings. High School bands performing in echoing gyms & mall atriums can sound excruciating-- even close up-- apart from the bad playing... Many listening positions in even good concert halls receive lots of reflected sound.
shadorne's avatar
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shadorne
7,467 posts
 
I consider the Anne-Sophie Mutter recording "Carmen Fantasie" as the ultimate test recording for treble sweetness.

That is an excellent recording - although I am not a fan of DG.

I'm wondering if this silky presentation can be considered as a hallmark of quality for amplifiers or rather a sort of coloration that makes the upper treble soft and "pretty"

Your description makes me think of Luxman SS amps of the 80's that did this kind of thing - I have always steered clear of amps that add coloration...I had one for a while (forget which model but it was high end SS) and it became irritating as you could hear the same coloration on everything - nice for light polite piano bar trio jazz with brushes but it spoiled other genres for me...

I find Mobile Fidelity Sound labs recordings often had this kind of "polish" in the highs on their CD recordings - I found it irritating too - I am not sure how they achieved the coloration...but I stopped buying after I noticed the same issue on albums from different artists.

IMHO, rather than focus on one recording - try a variety of recordings to see if the amp is making an honest uncolored presentation....this may mean that some recordings are too edgy or strident but others will bloom...all depending on what they did in the microphones/mix/mastering process.
dcstep
1,518 posts
 
A great system (not only the amp) can deliver highs with delicacy and richness with well recorded performances. The system is only as good as it's weakest link, so if your sources suck then no amp or preamp can rescue the signal.

Lack of glare, congestion and harshness are hallmarks of a fine system. Put a marginal speaker cable into an otherwise excellent system and you'll hear the glare and congestion.

If you hear delicate details, like fingers on strings, vocal overtones, natural sibilants and no harshness or glare, then you've got a high performance system. If the details are absent or rolled off, then you've got a system that trying to euphonically compensate by softening the highs artificially.

Listen for details and delicacy. Can you hear a bass note's fundemental separately from it's overtones. Can you hear "air" around the bass strings and the woody sound of the bass's body. With nylon-string guitar can you hear the ends of the fingers on the strings and can you tell if the player is using a lot of nail or a little?

Dave

Dave
nilthepill
842 posts
 
Dgarretson, This live performance was out in open. I agree with you generally regarding Typical High school band's playing capabilities. This High School band was somewhat special and hence invited to play at many places in So Cal, including Disneyland. Sure their playing can't be compared with Virtuoso artists. In any case, live is live. You can't beat that.
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