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Affordable electronics to suit Thiel 3.5 speakers

Hi All,
About a week ago I came across a really good buy on a pair of Thiel 3.5 speakers. I got them home put them in my existing system and noticed that while the bass was much improved and they showed significantly more detail then my Vandersteen 2CE's, they seemed to quite forward and bright.

I love detail and bass in my music (which is primarily orchestral and folk) and that aspect of the Thiels really appeals to me. Unfortunately, when I listen to them for any length of time they begin to seem almost harsh. Reading in the forum, I see numerous comments that Thiels simply will not sound good until they have excellent upstream electronics. My current upstream electronics, which sounded very good with the Vandersteens, are an Oppo 83SE player , Sony TAE 80 ES preamp and Acurus A150 amp. Interconnects are Kimber PBJ and DH Labs with Audioquest Cobalt speaker cables.

What I'm hoping is that some of you who are familiar with the Thiels can help me identify what steps I should take next. I'm a bit concerned that I just am not going to be able to make the Thiels work. My listening room is only 15 x 14 and because it has a very heavy one piece home-built sofa which is L-shaped, a fireplace, and because it connects two other rooms, the only location that I can put the speakers is 18 inches from the right wall, 36 inches from the left wall and 18 inches from the wall behind them. My listening position is 9 feet from the speakers. Because there is not much I can do with respect to speaker placement, if I am going to be able to make them work it will need to be through finding electronics that keep the detail and get rid of the harshness.

Because I am on a tight budget, expensive amplifiers are not an option. I do have coming to me from an Audiogon member a Threshold FET 9 preamp which I bought before I got the Thiels. I suspect this will help some, but the consensus seems to be that if I do not have a least 200W per channel, the Thiels just won't sound good. I have had good luck with Hafler amplifiers and wonder if perhaps replacing the Acurus with an old H500 would help significantly. In one post regarding Thiel 3.6 speakers, a member mentioned that a B&K EX 442 Sonata might be a good choice but I have no experience at all with this amplifier.

So, would those of you who have expertise regarding the speakers and what electronics might result in a substantial improvement in the problem areas please share your thoughts with me?

Thanks in advance,
Jay
drjay
unsound
7,329 posts
 
Your room is bit small for the Thiel 3.5's, but more importantly the dimensions are problematic. You might be better off using the 40 Hz setting on the EQ. I find them better firing straight forward rather than toed in, but your placement puts them pretty close to one wall. If you can get them out from the walls even a little bit, so long as your at least 8' from each speaker, things should improve somewhat. Again it's a tough fit.
Your on the right track re: power, but rather than 200 Watts per channel into 8 Ohms, think in terms of 400 Watts per channel into 4 Ohms. The upper end of the Acurus is a poor choice with Thiels.
I'm not exactly sure what your budget is, but used Threshold S 500 Series II, Krell KSA 250 and the conrad-johnson 2500A are very good considerations, the bigger Classe' amps aren't bad either. While they're not my favorites, I can understand why many like Levinson and Rowland with these speakers.
riley804
1,224 posts
 
Since funds are limited, room isnt ideal and current equipment doesnt work well with the Thiels, why not just sell them ?
tpreaves's avatar
tpreaves
2,682 posts
 
What do you consider "affordable"?
drjay OP
27 posts
 
Thanks for the responses so far. To provide a bit more information:
1. I don't want to sell them unless I just can't make them work well in my room because I truly like how they sound except for the "brightness". They have much better bass and seem more detailed and transparent than the Vandersteens and I value those characteristics a lot. Plus, it wouldn't be easy to resell the Thiels, the gentleman I got them from had listed them on Craigslist for $500 for 6 weeks with no calls when I spotted them.
2. I could stretch my buget to aroud $1500 total.
Since posting, I've been researching amps in my price range and wonder if besides the DH500 Hafler mentioned in my original post an Adcom 5802, an ATI 1502, or an Audio Research 100.2 might fix things up.
3. Also, please help my thinking here. Since the problem seems to be just in the upper frequencies which don't require much amplifier power, and because pretty loud playback levels in a small room only take a few watts with these speakers, am I barking up the wrong tree, so to speak, thinking more power will help significantly? A few folks have posted being very happy with these speakers with amps in the 50W range.
I will post what changes I hear when I put the Threshold FET 9 preamp in the system but I am not too hopeful about that since the TAE 80 ES was very close in sound to what I heard direct form the Oppo,when I did a bypass test with the Vandersteens.
Thanks for the help so far and please let me know your thoughts given this updated info.
Jay
digepix's avatar
digepix
121 posts
 
In a small room like yours you may be able to get by with 50W on Thiels. Those 50W would have to come from an amp comfortable with the Thiel 4 ohm load like a Krell KSA-50S not your Acurus. Of the amps you mentioned the Audio Research 100.2 is by far the best amp. A Classe CA-200 might work well with the Thiels. With inexpensive high watt amps think like this; if the first watt doesn't sound good why would you want 199 more just like the first.
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