12ax7 vs 5751

Dear Reynolds853:

I think the rib plates have a smooth sound, which to me means the sound isn't edgy. I just think rib plates provide a little more musical information around the edges of notes than the smooth.

This has also been my experience with Telefunken ribbed v. smooth. I also find the ribbed to be a bit punchier. I prefer them.

Best,
Bill

Ohnwy, yes I have tried (own) 7025's. They can be very good. I particularly liked the Raytheons. Having said that, and with all due respect to some of the comments above, there is no way that one can make a general comment about the superiority or inferiority of a particular 12ax7 variant without making it in the context of a particular circuit. My phono pre uses 12ax7's. I have tried (own) just about every NOS brand and variant of 12ax7, and as was the case after similar experimentation with various tube types in other pre's and amplifiers my conclusion was:

There are specific brand 5751's that can be magic in a particular circuit compared to all other 12ax7's or 7025's; and vise versa. In the case of my current phono pre, while some variants can sound very good (Raytheon 7025, Sylvania Gold 5751, and even the very rare CBS industrial 7729), when all is said and done, the best FOR ME and IN MY PRE are the Telefunken smooth plate 12ax7's; hands down.

In all my years of playing around with tubes I have heard nothing that definitively tells me that (for example) ALL 5751's sound better than all 12ax7's, or 7025's, etc, in a particular piece. IMO.

Frogman
Is it safe to say that a certain tube maintains characteristics regardless of component?(warm,detailed,etc)
I am trying to follow what you are stating...as I am looking for tubes for a preamp I just bought.

I can't answer for Frogman but I certainly think for the most part that a warm tube sounds warm where ever they are with a few exceptions. there is no doubt though, that certain tubes just don't work in all circuits. For me as a rule I tend to like 5751s in most situations. I did try 5751s in the output section of a Jolida CD player and it simply did not function. The sound was dreadful enough to make me think the tube had failed but it hadn't. The circuit for some reason was intolerant. Another exception was a highly modded ARC SP-6B which didn't change it's tone no matter what I put in it. It was brutally frustrating and a terrible combination with my speakers.
There are cases where the lower mu doesn't seem to work either. I have some real old unmodded vintage integrateds that used 12AX7s in the preamp section and frankly need the extra umph. A couple of them came loaded with Teles before tube rape was common. Curiuosly they respond quite well to current production in many instances where I have replaced the old tubes. The old tubes I then put into new amps and many sound fine go figure!

Mechans, you answered for me very nicely; actually.

***I certainly think for the most part that a warm tube sounds warm where ever they are with a few exceptions. there is no doubt though, that certain tubes just don't work in all circuits***

I completely agree, although I know some will disagree. I currently own one piece that uses 12ax7's, but own and use three that use 6dj8's. In all three pieces the Telefunken 6dj8 produces a full bodied, dimensional sound with a timbre closest to "neutral" as I define it; reminiscent of the classic Audio Research tonality. In one of the pieces, a modded Melos 222c occasionally used for it's line stage, the Teles' fullness and lack of zip or edge is too much of a good thing for this preamp which is inherently on the dark side. With this pre, West German Siemens 7308, which yields a brighter, less corpulent sound, with excellent high frequency extension is
much better. I hear similar tonality/timbre from my Tele 12ax7's in my
phono pre.