2. analog
  3. 1373770660

progress?

I know this subject has been visited and revisited. I'd like to approach it from a slightly different perspective. This is regarding the infamous Telarc 1812 overture with the digital cannons. In 1979, I purchased the recording and played it entirely satisfactorily with my Technics SLD2 or Sony PSX7 and Shure cartridges: M95e, V15III, etc. My AudioTechnica 12XE and 12 SA played it as well ,also MicroAcoustics, Acutex, and ADC cartridges without problems. Skip to 1984 or so; with the CD age, you could buy at thrift shops many by then older turntables: Onkyo, Pioneer, Sansui, Kenwood, Technics, Yamaha, etc. Well, those sometimes $10 or less turntables could also play the cannons without problems with the aforemention cart's without bouncing out of the groove. Ortofons or Stantons, even the 681EEE, could not do so unless you brought in a turntable with a servotracer arm [JVC, Denon, Sony, etc.] Keep in mind the total cost at thrift stores would be less than $50, whereas brand new equipment might have run as much as $200. OK; Look at today; I have had turntables from VPI, Project, Music Hall, Rega (3) priced from $1000 to $3000 which look silly when trying to play the 1812 Telarc cannons! This is progress?, I would like some input, and I'm fully aware of phono cartrige compliance assues,and tonearm weight, ec..
boofer
zd542
5,339 posts
 
I think I see what you are saying. It is a very interesting problem. I don't know that the answer is, but I'll make a couple guesses.

My first guess is that the older TT's may have been designed for DJ's or other commercial (non home) uses. For example, a TT in a night club needs to operate in an environment where there is a lot of vibrations.

Another factor may be room placement. The TT may be in a location where low frequencies interfere with it.

The rack, or whatever you have the TT sitting on may not be good enough to isolate the it properly. If that's the case, it would be easy why the problem will occur. Newer analog gear is much more sensitive. A good example is VPI. The slightest touch and those tonearms shake like a 90 year old alcoholic. The upside is the potential for better SQ.

Anyway, thats all I can think of.
almarg's avatar
Ag insider logo xs@2x
almarg
9,670 posts
 
07-14-13: Lewm
For one thing, typical modern MC cartridges often do not track as well as the old war-horse MM cartridges you mention.
+1. That is my impression as well. Same goes for the old war-horse MM cartridges vs. typical older MC cartridges, AFAIK.

Regards,
-- Al
boofer OP
86 posts
 
To all who have responded to my forum entry: In one sentence: why in 1980 could I buy a turntable such as a Technics SLD2 for $130 and a cartridge such as an Audio Tecnica 12XE for a total of $160, while today I might spend $3000 and still not be able to track the Telarc 1812 cannons[when I could do so with the $160 1980 expenditure]?
lewm
13,096 posts
 
Because you have made some bad buying decisions, if your sole goal is tracking the 1812 Overture, and because of inflation and the evolution of the "high end" as we now know it, and because to some degree "we" drank the moving coil Kool-Aid 30 years ago.
almarg's avatar
Ag insider logo xs@2x
almarg
9,670 posts
 
This photo of some of the grooves on that recording may be of interest to those who haven't physically seen it. Among other things, note the point near the center of the photo where there is an abrupt change of direction of around 45 degrees. IIRC, there were some other points that were even more severe, which don't appear in the photo.

I didn't purchase this recording, in part because the receiver I was using ca. 1980 would have clipped on the cannon shots if I listened at anything approaching reasonable volume. I did, however, borrow it from a friend and play it back at a very low volume setting, using a Sony direct drive turntable with its integrated arm, and a Shure cartridge. Had no tracking problems at all.

I believe that a few years later Telarc released a version of the recording that was somewhat easier to track.

Regards,
-- Al
More to discover