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How much can be measured -- and how much cannot?

There has been a lot of discussion over the years on Audiogon regarding the measurement of components and other audio products. Some people claim everything is either measurable now or will one day become measurable with more sophisticated measuring equipment. But others say there are things in high end audio that will never me measurable and that measurements are really not that important.

Here is a typical example -- a quote taken from the Stereophile forum regarding their review of the Playback Designs MPS-5:

"JA 2/17/10 Review Measurements of Playback Designs MPS-5
Posted: April 13, 2011 - 8:42am

John Atkinson's 2/17/10 review measurements of the Playback Designs MPS-5 revealed less than stellar technical performance even though Michael Fremer really liked the player. I've included JA's closing measurement remarks below followed by the manufacturer's comments.

To my knowledge there was never any followup in Stereophile regarding the manufacturers reply the MPS-5 could not be adequately measured with traditional measurement techniques.

I believe Stereophile should respond to this reply in the interests of its own measurements credibility.

Len"

How important do you think measurements are? Are the ears really the only true arbiter?
sabai
sabai OP
2,027 posts
 
Tbg,
I think you may have hit the nail on the head here: "My conclusion is that we can measure what is not important to what we hear."

I wonder if John Atkinson sits down to listen to a component after it shows bad measurements to see if he can hear anything wrong? If, for instance, he has bad measurements for a given component and Fremer or another reviewer says it's a great component, does John Atkinson sit down and try to reconcile the measurements with what his ears say -- if his ears tell him something different from what his measurements show? Or is this just an intellectual exercise for him? I wonder.
sabai OP
2,027 posts
 
Onhwy61,
You say "music and the emotions I bring to listening to music trumps the quality of equipment I'm using." This is an important matter that I started a thread on a while back called "What is Musicality?"

Nevertheless, getting closer to the essence of the music often helps get closer to the emotions, IMO. And for many of us getting closer to the essence of the music involves equipment mating to optimize sound quality. I used to get tremendous satisfaction from my transistor radio. But I doubt that I would get that same satisfaction from it today having been spoiled by the high end sounds of my system. There are degrees of satisfaction. The song is the same from a transistor radio and a high end system. But the extent to which you can appreciate and enjoy it can increase greatly if you hear the music in a refined system. IMO.
sabai OP
2,027 posts
 
I think one of the ineffable aspects of this is system synergy. You just never know what a cable or component or tweak change or addition will do to your system until you plug it in and turn the system on. No amount of understanding specs will give you this information. IMO.
unsound
7,332 posts
 
Tbg, I respectfully disagree. Things like frequency response and dBW just a couple of examples of measurements that can be important in regards to what we might expect to hear.
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Tbg,
I feel the same as sabai, you really made a point. If a component sounds good to M, Fremer and he raves about it then the 'bad' measurements by JA tell us exactly what in regard to the subsequent listening experience?
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