USB Ext Sound Card Vs. Squeebox

Guys - no difference between USB and Ethernet in terms of bandwidth - at least not that is relevant to this discussion. Very little data is required for audio - remember USB1.1 works just fine.

Hardwired (ie USB, Ethernet, FireWire etc) is always going to be more reliable then WiFi (wireless). Being nothing more then a small radio, WiFi is subject to interference where wire is not.

Technically a USB DAC that skips SPDIF and works in I2S will trump any USB SPDIF implementation. For instance Gordon Rankin's Wavelength series - Brick, Cosecant and Crimson. Also see the Empirical Audio website for more tech.

In my own rigs I have found that the SPDIF cable makes a big difference in the kind of setup Drubin has. I have been very happy with SBs modded by Bolder running Ethernet, and run them using their own audio out (ie using their internal DAC). Cosecant (and I assume Crimson) are better, as is a USB>adapter implementation with a high end DAC. Have had equally good results with a glass Toslink directly from the Mac to the DAC.

Lots of ways to go.

Seanchau wrote:
"USB is better than Wireless"

This is not a sound conclusion. Certainly not the case. Your experience shows that the particular implementations of wireless servers you auditioned are not as good as the particular USB implementations you auditioned. No broad conclusions can be drawn from this.

I say this because the fundamental physics of networked/wireless servers is actually superior to most USB implementations. Bit-perfect and local master clock. This is superior to most USB implementations. There is one exception that will match the quality possible with networked, namely the Crimson DAC from Wavelength which uses Asynchronous USB protocol.

You just need to listen to the right networked system and you will change your mind.

I just dont want others reading your post and being deterred from buying squeezebox, Sonos or others. They can sound as good or even better than USB with appropriate ancillary hardware.

Steve N.
Empirical Audio
Manufacturer

Interesting, Steve. So can you explain why USB is so superior to SB3 in my system (see post above) and what it would take to beat it with a wireless implementation (which would be my preference)? I'm not meaning to challenge you, just seeking your learned input.

Drubin - Probably because the SB3 jitter is worse than the HagUSB jitter. If both are playing back 16/44.1, the only difference should be jitter. However, depending on the software that you are using with the HAGUSB, such as ASIO and different players such as Foobar or Jriver, this can also have an effect, both positive or negative.

With networked players, either wired or wireless, there is only the bit-perfect data and the jitter. No software gets in the way.

If you want inaudible jitter with a SB3, Sonos or AirPort Express, then my Pace-Car reclocker can provide this:
http://www.empiricalaudio.com/frPace-Car.html

I am giving one away this year with the enjoythemusic.com promotion. If you join their mailing list, you are entered in the contest. There is no digital source available with lower jitter.

Steve N.

There were no sound difference between wireless and wired except for when my wireless router would drop (thanks to my neighbors cordless phones... changing my wireless channel away from stock and going to 5.8ghz phones solved this problem) Of Course having a Squeezebox without the wireless card will reduce contamination and that will probably make it sound better going wired, but the fact that TCP is a reliable transport that isn't colored by air or copper..(IT humor sorry)

The SB3 is thin sounding stock and not full unless you get a modified powersupply (not just cheap linear ($30-100) powersupply which I did not hear an upgrade) Once I went to my Bolder ultimate powersupply I had body again.

There were no other jitter changes or timing issues. in my comparisions.....so if you have a better DAC and digital cable things are probably different...

I still have a stock SB2 and powersupply to do direct comparisions into my DAC on another input and both can be playing the same song at the same volume level for comparisons.

My Setup
Thecus N5200 Pro Nas (music in FLAC), XP PC running Slimserver and DVR software, Wireless SB3 Bolder Digital mod and Bolder Ultimate powersupply and Bolder power cable, connected via Transparent Reference digital cable to my Theta Gen VIII (which has a Jitter Jail built in for fixing incoming digital inputs) to Theta Citadel amps to Wilson Maxx speakers.

Steve we get the point that you make the Pace Car.. but is it really necessary to tell everyone on every thread that this will fix everything??? I think not... slow down your posts, people do search for answers.