Do I Need A SUT


I recently moved from a PS Audio BHK Reference pre amp to an LTA ZTOL pre amp.  I found the LTA pre amp to be more detailed slightly warmer and it just sounded better in my system.  I also noticed a big difference in the output volumes between my digital rig and my analog rig. At the same volume level, my turntable volume is now much lower than my streamer volume, as opposed to the way it was before.

Analog gear - Technics SL-1200G turntable w/ Ortofon Quintet Black cartridge and PS Audio Stellar phono pre.  Digital gear: Innous Zenith MK2, Matrix DDC, and PS Audio DirectStream DAC MK2.  Power amp: PS Audio BHK250.  Speakers: Tannoy DC8-Ti.

Before, I used all Transparent Super XLR balanced interconnects, except for the turntable RCA cable into the phono pre.  Now, the only balanced cable is from my DAC to the ZTOL, which has only one XLR input.  I replaced my Transparent XLR interconnects with Transparent super RCA interconnects.

Do I need a SUT to get a higher level of sound at a lower volume setting?  My budget is $1,500.  I know nothing about SUTs other than what I've read. I'm considering the Ortofon ST-7.  Recommendations welcomed.

128x128oldschool1948

The balanced outs are usually 4v and unbalanced 2v.

In my experience, that's not been an issue. I would expect the preamp to balance that before it's output. But that's the only thing that comes to mind. 

I would ask the folks at LTA. Very helpful people.

I see the LTA preamp only has RCA outs so maybe the balanced input is going to be louder. You might be better off going all RCA for consistency. It's not going to affect sound quality with short cables.

To the best of my knowledge, the Stellar phono stage has more than adequate gain for your Ortofon Quintet (Stellar offers 44 to 56db gain via MM inputs; 60 to 72db gain via MC inputs). Furthermore the LTA linestage adds additional gain to the signal passing through it. So, in a word, no, there is nothing to be gained by adding a SUT in between those two items. But you provide very little other information. Do you perceive a lack of overall gain in your phono system? How have you connected your phono cable (the output from the Quintet) to the phono inputs on the Stellar (MM or MC inputs, gain setting)? There seems to be a fad around using a SUT whether one needs to or not, which is nonsensical to me. If you notice that you have to re-adjust the attenuator(s) on the LTA for analog vs digital, that is quite the norm and not a reason for concern.  Could possibly be ameliorated by choosing a higher gain setting on the Stellar.

I thought a SUT was only used when using a MC cart into an MM phono stage. Is it used in any other way?  BTW, I have to turn the volume knob up on my analog than  my digital. No big deal really. Not like I’m switching back and forth. 

You only need an SUT when your phono stage lacks enough gain for a LOMC cartridge.

OK, so I don't need a SUT 😁!

@lewm @jasonbourne71 Of the three gain levels on the Stellar, my system sounds best at the lower setting, which is the recommended setting for the LOMC Cadenza Black. The other two don't sound as smooth. I've also used Stellar's custom loading option set at 30Hz, but finally settled on 60Hz. 

@mashif I'm going to try the all RCA route, which should reduce the DSD output a bit.  I've been playing the DAC at 90% volume level for years. If necessary, I'll futz with that some more to get the two a little closer together. 

Regarding LTA, you are correct. I live about 45 minutes from their office. It's always a pleasure going their - everyone is very nice, very accommodating, and fun to be around. Nicholas has been very accommodating, allowing me to home audition their preamps and power amps. I'm looking to audition their new DAC soon.

Thanks everyone for your help!

I am guessing you meant you’re setting the input impedance of the Stellar at 60 ohms, not 60 Hz. Also, I think the LTA is a single-ended device, so no matter what inputs or outputs you use going in to the LTA, the signal out of the LTA is SE

@lewm You are correct on all accounts!

I replaced the DAC’s Transparent Super XLR cables with Kimber Select KS 1010 RCA cables. I use the Kimber cables on my R2R. The sound with the Kimber cables is noticeably better.  

I left the DAC volume at 90%, and tried various Stellar gain and input impedance combinations. The best combination was gain at medium and impedance at 200ohms. That same combination didn’t work as well with my BHK pre amp and Transparent XLR cable.

Now, both the turntable and DAC sound about equal in volume using the same LTA pre amp volume setting. Tomorrow, I’m going to put the Transparent XLR cable back on the DAC to see how much of change that will make.  

There is no particular reason to worry that the attenuators need to be set differently for analog vs digital, unless you’re prone to forget to turn down the volume before switching from analog to digital and fear speaker damage. Otherwise I personally set up analog gain for max SQ regardless of high level inputs.

Did you buy the better LTA pre with the Lundahl transformer option ? 
well worth the  $$ and in your unit you have a 3 way dip switch for gain 

You should be running all the same xlr throughout  for best synergy .

@audioman58 

The LTA preamp has the Lundahl transformer on input to convert it to SE. You can only use XLR there. The rest are all RCA. Changing the overall gain won't change the difference in level between his phono pre and his DAC. 

 

 

@lewm Sometimes, I like to A/B listen to the same album streamed from Qobuz or Tidal and played on my TT. Having the volume of each close helps with that. The LTA remembers volume settings for each input, so I don't worry when I switch from the streamer to the TT, to the R2R.

@audioman58 I have the Level Two version:

  • Preamp output cap upgrade: The headphone and the preamp outputs have been separated, and different types of output caps, optimized for each output, are installed. The preamp cap is upgraded to a premium Clarity CMR.

  • Power supply cap upgrade: The power supply caps and power storage caps on the audio board are changed to Mundorf Mlytic AG capacitors. The total amount of storage is increased by 22,000uF.

I'm quite happy with the SQ improvements the RCA cable and TT setting changes had on my system. 

The Kimber cable improvement was unexpected. Voices and instruments sound more natural, there's more separation and definition between them, and the sound is a bit warmer with no loss of detail.

My TT has always sounded great to me. It has always sounded slightly warmer and more full bodied than my streamer.  

These improvements cost me $0, and just a little experimentation and time.  Thanks to everyone for your insight and help.