More setup info would be nice.....I too have 1.6s, and think as shipped they are a little beamy.
My first reaction would be to flip 'em around and listen to the OTHER side of the speaker...the side that you can't see the mylar from. That's right, put the connector/fuse side FACING the listener. At the same time, experiment with tweeter in/out. Make sure you have enough room in back of the speaker, too. Most like at least 5 feet for rear wave time reasons.
Also, are your panels straight up or 'tilted' with the spacers? Try 'em straight up, if tilted. Lay the panel face down, flat on a large table to do so. That'll take the stress of the stand screws.
When you get them exactly where you like them, get out the long tape measure. Measure from the side stiles to the wall. Measure inside between 'em. Measure side clearence to the walls. Write it all down. |
Hi, Have you tried tilting the speakers forward?
Randy |
Rac,
Maggies are shipped with tilting spacers. IF the speakers in question have the little nylong spacers installed on the bottom screws of the stands, that tips 'em back. Some owners like them tipped back, others like myself, go with straight up/dn.
In general, I've never heard of tilting them forward. You will start getting floor reflection problems, which depending on ceiling height and IF they are indeed tilted back, may actually be the issue.....ceiling bounce. |
Relative to set-up, my room is smallish. It's 11'x14' with an 8 foot ceiling.
It will be somewhat of a challenge to give the speakers a 5 foot breather from the wall - but I'll try. I have hardwood floors with an area rug in the middle. The walls are not dampened - just normal walls with a few paintings hanging.
The speakers are currently straight. I tilted them forward last night by about 5 degrees but I did not notice any difference; the sweet spot was still 5 feet off the floor. Also, the sweet spot is very wide/long at this height; whether I was 3 feet or 10 feet away from the speakers, the sound was outstanding 5 feet off the floor.
Let me know if you need more information. |
Boy, you are really in luck. I have a life guard seat that was used at a pool. It puts you five feet up, where you can survey your domain. Cost? Free if you come and get it. It is in Timbuktu, nothing but desert here. So, hurry before the native carry it off. |
Have you tried a L/R swap or tweeters in/out or ANY modified setup.
Some of the folks over at Audio Asylum / planar division may be able to help.
A few over there put the speakers EDGE ON to the listener, sitting in the side null point and relying on reflected sound. The claims are pretty ambitious.
How much toe are you using right now? Are the speakers IN PHASE? Please check 2x! Swap one +- to be sure. Are BOTH fuses OK? Pull 'em and check with a meter. 4A fuses sometimes pop and still look OK.
Since I'm not there, unless you are local, in which case a housecall will cost a beer, you're going to have to mess with it until you get it. At some point, IGNORE THE DIRECTIONS and just try anything. At some point, it'll click.
BTW, 11x14 is an awful small space for Maggies. This may be the 'root' cause of your issue. |
I would take a little time and see if the soundstage height grows on you. Many people with box speakers wish they could get the soundstage height up and Maggie owners are often happy that finally they have found a speaker with a realistic sound stage height and size. |
Magfan, I turned the speakers around and had tweeters in/out but still got the same results. I pulled the speakers forward about 3 feet and brought my listening chair closer and then I narrowed the gap between the speakers.
I made one change at a time and each time listened to the same musical passage. It seems to me that when I brought the speakers closer to one another, the sound had more depth. I'll listen a few days and then tweak the set-up some more.
The fuses were good. Phase was confirmed. I don't know what you mean by toe in?
Thanks for the help so far. |
Switch,
good, your doing the right stuff with setup.
Toe? IF both edges of the speaker are the same distance to the front wall, ZERO toe. This is almost always a bad idea. Toe IN is generally the way panels are arranged. Toe in will be when the line straight from each speaker crosses in front or in back of you. This will adjust image width and can sometimes result in a hole in the middle. Toe 'in' results in the outer edges of the speaker being further from the wall than the inside edge.
Some even recommend placing the speaker EDGE ON to the listener. This is another set of experiments.
Again, you have a smallish room. I have used Maggies in such a small room many years ago and basically listened near field, making my panels into a huge set of headphones. |
Magfan, thanks for the Toe explanation. The outer toes are further away from the wall.
I'm not sure if I need to start another thread but do you have any experience on how to fix mylar that is pleated?
I discovered a couple of days ago that when I played music with a boomier base one of my speakers was vibrating in the upper woofer area. I never noticed this before, I'm guessing because I used these maggies exclusively for jazz and classical.
I did some research and found that some owners had experienced similarly and discovered the root cause was the separation of the thin wire from the Mylar. Thinking this was the problem I proceeded to purchase the 3M adhesive from Magnaplan. When I removed the sock from the speaker I found the wires to be intact and well bonded to the mylar. Instead I found the mylar pleated at the top left corner of the frame. It looks like the film had not been stretched out properly during manufacturing. It's all bunched up in this area with an approximate coverage of 10 square inches. I confirmed that the cracking/buzzing/distorted sound was coming from the pleated area by playing the track that I originally discovered it with.
I opted not to touch it further but rather take photos and submit them to Magnaplan@service.com with a report of my findings.
The warrantee expired in 08' but I'm hoping that they will recognize this to be a workmanship issue and make me whole. or at the very least, offer a quick fix.
I emailed my report and pics yesterday. I'll call on Thursday to see if they have logged my complaint and determine if they have made a disposition.
I tried pasting some pics of the pleats but it wont allow me to. Is there a way I can add photos to this site? I want to alert Maggie owners that such defect can occur and will most definitely affect sound. I never got an opportunity to audition these in the store. They were back-ordered and my decision to buy was based on an audition of a floor model. I probably used them for about 100 hours and they were packed in their original packaging for almost 4 years until I decided to set them up last weekend. |
You are past my direct knowledge.
HOWEVER, I'd recommend posting at Audio Asylum....in the Planar section.
Post a picture, too.
Magnepan is frequently knocked for quality issues. Given the bang/buck ratio, people tend to put up with it. I woudn't, and if I had the chance to speak with Wendel, quality would be my #1 concern. I've had extensive quality training and bring some real experience to the table. I'd work for a couple months for a pair of 20.1s, and help with all quality issues.
Magnepan, I'm told, changed glues sometime back. They formerly used 3M77 and an overcoat. The DIY crowd likes Gorilla Glue!
Post back with results of your querry to Magnepan. You can call 'em, too, and ask to speak with Wendel. He's a great guy to deal with and the 'go to' man. |
Thanks for the advice. I'll call Wendel. We probably have a great deal in common in terms of quality fundamentals as I have been in the quality/technical field for 25 years.
I'll keep you posted.... |
I do not understand your problem. When I sit in my seat my ears are between 4' & 5' from the floor. The sweet spot is never at floor level because the speaker drivers are not horizontal along to the floor but vertical from floor to ceiling except center speakers for HT. |
When I'm sitting in my listening chair my ears are 3.6 feet from the floor. In my case the music is much more dynamic and engaging at 5 feet plus.
By manipulating the speaker placement in my room, I was able to lower the sweet spot somewhat. It's much better now thanks to feedback I received from this thread.
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Is your head above the chairs back, also do you use a chair or couch? If you sit forward does the sound also get better? Where is the sound stage, high on the wall or at head level and lower? |
