The Frogman:
EXCELLENT!! This is one of the most refreshing and encouraging things I have seen from the young folks in years. The Nicholas Brothers circa the 21st century!?!? The great stuff stays great forever!
The Jazz was great also. But it was hard to seperate the music from the dance, which is, as it should be. A Seamless performance.
My Father used to have shoes like those. He had Black and White and Brown and White. My job, shine them!
Great clip. Thanks.
Cheers |
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Hi Orpehus - I happened to come across a photo today of the woman who recorded much of the singing for Rita Hayworth in her musicals - Nan Wynn. Didn't look up a discography for her or anything, just happened across the name and thought you might be interested. |
What a coincident, I was listening to Nancy in the car on my way home; yes, she's very sensual. You and Leersfool have given me a new perspective on the same music I've been listening to for all of my life. Take "On Green Dolphin Street" for example; I never gave any thought as to who composed it, now I'm listening to solo piano by Bronislaw Kaper, the composer of this beautiful tune. When played by him, the music takes on a lighter than air quality, the notes just float. While this music tells a story that I'm unaware of, that's just as well because it allows me to invent my story for the music. One thing is certain, I get a glorious feeling when I'm "On Green Dolphin Street". Now I'm going to give you Miles Davis's "On Green Dolphin Street". First, we have the lush beautiful intro by Bill Evans on piano, followed by Miles trumpet, and Trane's improvisation. All of these musicians show great respect for the composer. That lets me know the depth of their musical knowledge. Once again, I get that glorious feeling from being "On Green Dolphin Street". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrVnm66joQkEnjoy the music. |
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That was a nice clip, Orpheus! They were hoping Abbe Lane would possibly be another Rita Hayworth, but that obviously did not pan out. She wasn't the dancer Hayworth was, and she certainly didn't have the acting chops. She sang better, though - she is actually more famous for that - she performed with alot of big bands in that era, though I don't think she actually recorded much. |
Sensuality is such a rare quality I couldn't even find an adequate definition. Although we know it when we see, hear, or feel that state of being, words can't quite express it; music, however is much better at expressing "sensuality". "She is Michelle" by Gato Barbieri is a good example for me. What music expresses this quality for you? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G0SZ4rE-QJoEnjoy the music. |
How did it happen that the American public has gotten so far away from being able to appreciate production values like this. The feeling of sensuality in that scene is amazing. Today we get explicit sexuality as an attempt to make up the for the absence of the art of simplicity and subtlety. The music (and playing) is fabulous, perfectly appropriate and beautiful. And what a gorgeous woman that dancer is!
Loved the clip. Thanks. |
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*****Frogman was the last person to submit music on this "music" forum******
Well hush my mouth.
Cheers |
Rok-not to worry. Thanks for the reply. We'll get it figured out. Hoping maybe Orpheus has an idea. Crazy times indeed. Creativity busting out all over. In the intervening years...money & lawyers have f'd up a lot of things
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Ghosthouse:
Sorry, but it does not ring a bell with me. That was a 'crazy' time. lots of folks, saying lots of stuff. But a very creative period.
My sister sent me the Last Poets LP as a gift a lifetime ago. I later got it on CD. If you ever need an example of what being 'political Incorrect' means, this be it!!
I think they were from Philly. Sorry I could not be of more help with what you are looking for. Thanks for the post.
Cheers |
Sorry for the double post above. But, Rok2id, YES! a group like the Last Poets might have done what I heard but as best I can tell what I'm looking for was not by them. Please advise if otherwise Thank again. |
Orpheus & Rok2id - hopefully not completely hijacking this thread but possibly taking it on a little off road excursion that will get it back to your intended course in short order....
The recent exchange about "rap" reminded me of something I heard on WXPN (adult alternative public radio out of Phila.) several years ago. It was, I think, a "pre-rap" song the gist of the lyric being that Jesus was a black man...went into some detail on His lineage justifying this take on Him. VERY powerful and literate. I'd love to listen to it again but have not been able to find it. My sense of the period it was from is probably late '60s maybe '70s. I have searched old radical black groups & black poets from the era to no avail. Hoping this might trigger a memory with you. Thanks in advance. |
Orpheus & Rok2id - hopefully not completely hijacking this thread but possibly taking it on a little off road excursion that iwill get it back to your intended course in short order....
The recent exchange about "rap" reminded me of something I heard on WXPN (adult alternative public radio out of Phila.) several years ago. It was, I think, a "pre-rap" song the gist of the lyric being that Jesus was a black man...went into some detail on His lineage justifying this take on Him. VERY powerful and literate. I'd love to listen to it again but have not been able to find it. My sense of the period it was from is probably late '60s maybe '70s. I have searched old radical black groups,black poets from the era to no avail. Hoping this might trigger a memory with you. Thanks in advance. |
Frogman was the last person to submit music on this "music" forum, he submitted "Chucho Valdes". Now I know why that name confuses me; his father was Bebo Valdes, jazz ran in the blood of the Valdes family. Before that, I posted "Ernesto Lecuona", who was a prolific composer of songs for music and films. Ruben Gonzalez performs "Siboney" by Lecuona. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3F7SCs3UtwHere is more of Lecuona's music by Catrena Valente. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_N4wfVdw-8Enjoy the music. |
O-10,
If you disagree with my post, Read my first sentence again. If you are in agreement with my post, then never mind.
The poets were rappers. They just talked about different and important things with intelligence, using street language. What they created was later 'hijacked' by the thugs who turned it into the ho thingy. Just as bebop somehow ended up being 'FREE'.
The thing is defined by the first, not the current. They just corrupted it.
Cheers |
"Aficionados", you're conflating "RAP" with social commentary. "The Last Poets" was social commentary, Gil Scott-Heron would turn over in his grave if you called him a "Rapper". Is poetry "RAP"? Not all words spoken in rhyme and rythm are "RAP".
It's the intellectual content of the "Rap" that distinguishes one rap from another. "RAP" is almost exclusively about bitches, ho's and the low life style of pimps and thugs in as vulgar a language as possible.
Get real, we're talking gang life culture that's exploited for what it's worth, that's "RAP"; however, when we blame the people caught up in that culture, we're blaming the victim for the crime.
Once upon a time, there were people called "sociologist" who worked hard to explain, and prevent thug culture from spreading; but it was much cheaper not to hire people who worked to remedy the cause of the problem, and let the people deal with it as best they could.
Although this culture is closely related to poverty, the culture remains even after the artists have become millionaires, as we have witnessed; but to understand how people caught up in that culture are the victims as opposed to the criminals is beyond current thinking in this society. "Rap" goes far beyond music or social commentary.
Now you see how easy it is to "just enjoy the music".
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I think we can say that RAP was hijacked. In the beginning it was good, even great. Sort of like an urban version of Dylan.
Then folks figured out you didn't much to do it. No talent or musical training. Anyone with a loud foul mouth could do it. Lot of money to be made with little overhead.
But if you don't understand the 'RAP' phenomenon, just remember the advice of Deep Throat, 'Follow the Money'!
I have a CD by Ice-T and Quincy Jones that is not too bad. Even has 'Birdland' on it. Ice-T raps.
If you want the real deal, try 'The last Poets'. I warn you, not to everyone's taste, but great and painfully accurate commentary on inner city life. From the 70s, but sadly, still revelant. And they point the finger at the correct people. Truly urban Dylan.
Currently listening to Woody Shaw's WOODY III. Will report later.
Cheers |
Check this out. Killer arrangement, smoking rhythm section and great solos. Love the way that Valdes relaxes the time feel when he plays the well-known Zawinal melody over the drummer's simple but relentless and driving groove. Great stuff! http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=x2W8gbBzvUU |
Orpheus10, completely agree about Lecuona; some of the most beautiful.
An honest and well intended observation about a previous comment you made:
*****Am I the only person who finds it difficult to appreciate "solo" piano; where's the bass, where's the saxophone, where's the something besides a lone piano. No reflection on the music or the artist, but a personal observation of my perception of music; I need a combination of instruments.
While it's been nice to hear Kaper's music played on solo piano by Kaper, this listener requires a band in order for the music to project a wide range of emotions, and get me involved.*****
Glad you enjoy the solo piano by Lecuona. |
The subject of RAP makes my head hurt. I am not prepared to say that it is not music, but I do know that if it is music, it is not music that I can relate to nor want to relate to. It doesn't fit my, and most traditional, definitions of music (no melody/harmony), but it certainly occupies a place in current culture that more traditional musics have previously; obviously, particularly in the segement of our population that gave birth to it. I agree with much of Orpheus10's characterization of it in that it is a social statement, but it seems to me that it represents far more than a subculture; it is now pervasive in our culture. As Rok points out, it is everywhere. And how sad it is that the generation and ethnic group that supports it primarily are so clueless about the incredibly rich musical history that they are neglecting instead; much of it discussed in this thread. |
Malaguena -- was on one of the first Classical records I owned. A 101 strings LP. One of my favorites. I am am now searching for an up to date recording , orchestral, of the great Spanish music. The CD of the 101 strings' 'Soul of Spain' sounds horrible.
Cheers |
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*****very few people realize what RAP is. It's not music***
You joshing me?? hahahahaha
Well based on your statement, I am one of the chosen few!
Cheers
BTW, saw a thingy on tv today about local RAPPERS in the Republic of Georgia. It's everywhere, it's everywhere! |
Rok, very few people realize what RAP is. It's not music, it's a social statement about The United States of America, made by a "Sub Culture" created by "The United States of America". 100 plus years of social and economic deprivation has resulted in a culture that's reflected by RAP; just listen to the lyrics and you'll see what I mean.
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Frogman, that is nice. I do not see it on vinyl, but will get it anyway.
Thanks |
http://www.pbs.org/newshour/businessdesk/2013/06/how-to-conduct-beethoven-and-m.html
Very interesting. There was also a segment on PBS today concerning the pay scales and job oppourtunities for classical musicians, dancers and singers in the US. I could not find it online. it's worth searching for.
Bottom line, you do it,(classical artistic stuff) because you love it, cause you sure aren't going to make any money doing it. Europe is an exception. Seems as if 50% of our best go work there.
But at least we got our RAP!!! So there!
Cheers |
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One of the most beautiful things I have heard in a while. Very distinctive tenor sound and an interpretation of this great tune that is intimate, tender, and intelligent. Charles Lloyd is without question one of the greats. Jason Moran on piano is wonderful. A great pairing. http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jzcfobcXnXg |
Rok, I don't know why, but classical music instantly causes flash-backs of the movie "Clockwork Orange".
Good music is just that "Good Music", no matter what the genre. I've been hearing the name "Conway Twitty" since I can remember, but he has never been on my "playlist"; now, thanks to you, he's on my "A" playlist. Find the best and leave the rest.
Enjoy the music.
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O-10:
Very good. I like Dorothy Ashby. I listened to 'Misty' and 'House of The Rising Sun' along with the link you sent.
The harp did not sound out of place in the least. She had good players in the group also.
Music like this and you just know there are / will be, many CDs.
Some tunes / groups, you just know you are listening to what will be their entire output. I will have to get some of her stuff and read her history.
Thanks for the tip.
Jazz makes up about one third of my toatal number of CDs. So Like you, I listen to other stuff also. This thread got me back to Jazz more than I would have normally.
Today, it was, Haydn- The London Symphonies Vol 1 and the A Cappella group, The Persuasions.(A cappella soul) Both Great!
Cheers |
Rok, I like crispy fried chicken, and I also like the same kind of classic jazz as you, but I don't want either one of them every day. Here is an artist that rarely tread well worn paths in regard to her jazz, even her instrument of choice, jazz harp was a bit unusual. Along with Alice Coltrane, Dorothy Ashby extended the popularization of jazz harp past a novelty, showing how the instrument can be utilized seamlessly as much a bebop instrument as the saxophone. Her albums were of the jazz genre, but often moved into R&B, world and other musics, especially on her 1970 album The Rubaiyat of Dorothy Ashby, where she demonstrates her talents on another instrument, the Japanese koto, successfully integrating it into jazz. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lY8k9sFZNwAEnjoy the music. |
Olatunji: Now that's a blast from the past. I have that tune on his 'Drums of Passion' CD.
I listened to him back in my Dylan, Baez, Saint-marie, (the young have all the answers) Phase.
The drumming is good. I just get tired, and quickly, of the repetitive chant. Esp since I have not a clue as to what he is saying.
Cheers |
Normally I own all the CDs I 'review'. These are exceptions. But not for long. High quality Video, Audio and Performances.
I recommend anything by Bebo Valdes. I Discovered Diego El Cigala thru BBC music magazine article. He and Bebo are awesome together, as is Bebo and Chucho Valdes. These guys are 'serious' musicians. No jeans with holes in the knees here. Check it out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iJGPlSrbUbg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzKhwmFq6jM
Cheers |
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I can't turn my back for five minutes, and you guys are right back in that third world stuff. I thought you had all been converted to the real deal. Remember, it don't mean a thing, if.........
Looking for Religion? May i suggest this!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOU38qRJPok
Cheers |
Rok, you asked me what kind of music I liked besides jazz, well occasionally I get religion and want to go to Saturday Night Church; this is what it's all about. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9W3PcsjFBoEnjoy the music. |
Just noticed someone mentioned the tune "Angel Eyes" a couple of days ago. For all those who have not heard it, you MUST listen to Ella's rendition of this on her 40th Birthday Concert album, which was recorded live in Rome. Fantastic album, by the way, one of her very best, and that tune is one of the highlights of it. |
Frogman, "Bengal And Beyond", including the sax works for me. Afro Cuban is just another one of the many fusions that work with jazz. On this tune I like the jazzy vocalizing. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FUFqUur7bZgNow let us compare "Bengal And Beyond" to the Dave Brubeck Quartet from the album "Jazz Impressions of Eurasia" doing Calcutta Blues. I'm comparing the fusion of jazz with Indian music and how well it works. At the same time I'm illustrating what was done by a master, long before "Bengal And Beyond" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qNlHh4FiZoEnjoy the music. |
OK, since you opened the door with the 'Bengal Jazz' clip, here's one by the outstanding NY Gypsy All-Stars. Probably not going to float everybody's boat, but give it a chance. It's great stuff!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p66kffsA_mQ&feature=player_detailpage
Listening to them led me to this band featuring 2 of it's members in a different setting/group; The Secret Trio. I love this record!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBNGLSLwjbA&feature=player_detailpage |
Orpheus10, thanks for the link to the Radhakrishnan link. I enjoy the fusion of ethnic music within a jazz setting (jazz quartet). However, I find Bengal-jazz fusion to be generally less successful than, for instance, Afro-Cuban jazz. This particular example, while pleasant and competent, never really takes off for me. Likewise, the saxophone playing is not particularly inspired. The tone is not as well developed as that of most good jazz players and is consistently flat in pitch. Overall, the feeling that I am left with is that of a better university music school jazz quartet recital.
Glad you enjoyed (with reservations) the Bronislaw Kaper solo piano recommendation. Give it more of a chance, the positives (personal and insightful interpretations as only a composer can) transcend the minimalist setting.
Regards. |
Recent Arrival:
Freddie Hubbard & Jimmy heath
JAM GEMS - "LIVE" AT THE LEFT BANK
Great Live recording. You know the audience is there, but it adds to the peformance. The sound is, as if you are sitting in the crowd. Might not be to 'audiophile' taste. Jazz lovers should love it. I think it was recorded by a Jazz Society in Baltimore.
Excellent liner notes, that even address why some folks just can't let go of the OLD stuff. Includes me.
Doc Pomus is quoted, explaining the difference between a studio record and a "LIVE" performance from the musicians perspective.. Very interesting.
The playing is just awesome. The tune 'Bluesville' almost approaches 'Hog Calling Blues'. Not quite, but that type of tune. You could say, 'they turned the joint out.' It was a true Jam Session, as the title states.
The rhythm section is not known to me, but they hung with the horns. All the tunes are long. 'Autumn Leaves' goes 17 minutes. Check it out.
Highly Recommended.
Cheers |
O-10, I like the Prasant. First thing I hear is the good tone. They are playing in a different dialect of the Jazz language. I will have to listen some more. Regarding pianist, I like to hear them in both settings. The group interaction is always of interest to me. Not just their solo's, but what do they add to the others. I also am interested in how they play when they have to carry everything on their own. Different ways of listening and playing. One Saxophonist I followed and lost track of, is Craig Handy. I will have to see what he is doing today. Saw him with Herbie around this time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKlFv0mhi3s |
Leersfool, this version of "On Green Dolphin Street" has to be my favorite. Bill Evans "intro" on piano is what sets this version off from so many others, and of course Miles and Cannonball are really beautiful as well; but it's still Bill Evans piano that takes it away. It's amazing how just one song can take you down so many very interesting paths; from Bronislaw Kaper, to Miles Davis. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrVnm66joQkEnjoy the music. |
Isochronism, your recommendation "Angel Eyes" by Jimmy Smith is a real winner. Like good wine, he's improved with age. His ability to plumb the musical depths of these standards, plus the very skillful use of excellent sidemen, made up for the lack of "fireworks" I've always associated with "Jimmy Smith".
While the names of some of the sidemen were new to me, I'll look for them in the future.
Enjoy the music.
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Am I the only person who finds it difficult to appreciate "solo" piano; where's the bass, where's the saxophone, where's the something besides a lone piano. No reflection on the music or the artist, but a personal observation of my perception of music; I need a combination of instruments.
While it's been nice to hear Kaper's music played on solo piano by Kaper, this listener requires a band in order for the music to project a wide range of emotions, and get me involved.
Enjoy the music.
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Speaking of famous solos:
Would anyone care to comment on Paul Gonsalves' 'Interlude' :) on 'Diminuendo in Blue and Crescendo in Blue'? Ellington at Newport.
I will assume we all have this! If not, turn in your Jazz Aficionado membership Card.
Cheers |
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