2. analog
  3. 189527-245

MC-MM-MI CARTRIDGES . DO YOU KNOW WHICH HAS BETTER QUALITY PERFORMANCE? REALLY?

Dear friends:The main subject of this thread is start a dialogue to find out the way we almost all think or be sure about the thread question :  " true " answer.

 

Many years ago I started the long Agon MM thread where several audiophiles/Agoners and from other audio net forums participated to confirm or to discover the MM/MI/IM/MF/HOMC world and many of us, me including, was and still are" surprised for what we found out in that " new " cartridge world that as today is dominated by the LOMC cartridges.

 

Through that long thread I posted several times the superiority of the MM/types of cartridges over the LOMC ones even that I owned top LOMC cartridge samples to compare with and I remember very clearly that I posted that the MM and the like cartridges had lower distortion levels and better frequency range quality performance than the LOMC cartridges.

 

In those times j.carr ( Lyra designer ) was very active in Agon and in that thread  I remember that he was truly emphatic  posting that my MM conclusion was not  true due that things on distortion cartridge levels in reality is the other way around: LOMC has lower distortion levels.

 

Well, he is not only a LOMC cartridge designer but an expert audiophile/MUSIC lover with a long long and diverse first hand experiences listening cartridges in top TT, top tonearms and top phono stages and listening not only LOMC cartridges but almost any kind of cartridges in his and other top room/systems.

 

I never touched again that subject in that thread and years or months latter the MM thread I started again to listening LOMC cartridges where my room/system overall was up-graded/dated to way superior quality performance levels than in the past and I posted somewhere that j.carr was just rigth: LOMC design were and are superior to the other MM type cartridges been vintage or today models.

 

I'm a MUSIC lover and I'm not " married " with any kind of audio items or audio technologies I'm married just with MUSIC and what can gives me the maximum enjoyment of that ( every kind )  MUSIC, even I'm not married with any of my opinions/ideas/specific way of thinking. Yes, I try hard to stay " always " UNBIASED other than MUSIC.

 

So, till today I followed listening to almost every kind of cartridges ( including field coil design. ) with almost every kind of tonearms and TTs and in the last 2 years my room/system quality performance levels were and is improved by several " stages " that permits me better MUSIC audio items judgements and different enjoyment levels in my system and other audio systems. Yes, I still usemy test audio items full comparison proccess using almost the same LP tracks every time and as always my true sound reference is Live MUSIC not other sound system reproduction.

 

I know that the main thread subject is way complicated and complex to achieve an unanimous conclusions due that exist a lot of inherent differences/advantages/unadvantages in cartridges even coming from the same manufacturer.

 

We all know that when we talk of a cartridge we are in reality talking of its cantilever buil material, stylus shape, tonearm used/TT, compliance, phono stage and the like and my " desire " is that we could concentrate in the cartridges  as an " isolated " audio item and that  any of our opinions when be posible  stay in the premise: " everything the same ".

 

My take here is to learn from all of you and that all of us try to learn in between each to other and not who is the winner but at the " end " every one of us will be a winner.

 

So, your posts are all truly appreciated and is a thread where any one can participates even if today is not any more his analog alternative or is a newcomer or heavily experienced gentleman. Be my guest and thank's in advance.

 

Regards and ENJOY THE MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,

R.

Ag insider logo xs@2xrauliruegas
mijostyn's avatar
mijostyn
8,224 posts
 

@rauliruegas I have talked recently about the Clearaudio Charisma which I have owned. It is a fun cartridge for rock and roll because it is very dynamic and has great bass, it is also dark, tilted towards the bass. The Voice is a better tracker and is dead neutral. I set up a few inexpensive ATs for friends and I thought they sounded great for the price, but the build quality was questionable. One had a positive rake angle of 76 degrees, comically way off. It was returned for replacement.  The Goldring 1042 is the best current MM cartridge I have recently heard, but not in my system and I have not been able to examine one under the microscope. I am not going to go out and purchase a pile of MM cartridges on a lark. My own experience suggests to me that the more expensive cartridges have better overall build quality which should not surprise anyone. In short, I have heard MI cartridges that can compete with the best LOMC cartridges. I have yet to hear a MM cartridge that can compete with the best LOMC cartridges. People will talk lovingly of old MM cartridges as if they were better than strawberry rhubarb pie. I have not had that experience so I can not comment. Back when I had those cartridges, Stantons, Empires, ADC's, Shures, Pickerings and B+O's, my system was not near what it is today. I do find it interesting that my favorite cartridge was the B+O. Go figure. 

Next I am going to find out just how good or bad these new R T R prerecorded tapes are. I was just given a Nagra IV-SJ! What a beautiful little thing. It's  outboard power supply is dead. I have a new one coming. Once I am sure everything is working I'll get the 10.5" adapter set and try a tape. If it does not sound as good as people say it does it will still make a handsome display piece. I do not intend on recording anything myself which is a good thing because it only takes these crazy scientific microphones. I would have to buy an outboard microphone pre amp. 

 

pennfootball71's avatar
pennfootball71
248 posts
 

MC

terry9
2,242 posts
 

AT ML180 OCC that can beats any SS MI today cartridges but not only the AT outperforms several cartridge today designs but other MM too as:

Am I correct in thinking that this is your favourite MM? Would you care to say more about why you like it? Transients, smoothness, lack of high frequency emphasis, etc.

 

 

 

Ag insider logo xs@2x
rauliruegas OP
12,836 posts
 

Dear @mijostyn  : I listened at least 4 times the SS SG cartridge and twice with my LP tracks and no mistracking issues, additional here mke246 use it against a great cartridge tracking as is the Shure he uses and he posted the SG is better in that specific regards.

 

R.

mke246
31 posts
 
@mijostyn 

 The Armstrong sounds great. None of my 78's sound that good. It sounds pretty much like the Caruso I have, all midrange. Are you using a pop and click filter?

I run my system through a CEDAR Cambridge computer and into the digital input of Genelec monitors, so I can use any type of declicking and signal processing I want, from hardly anything to extremely aggressive. 78 clicks are much more difficult than vinyl clicks, so it's usually a moderate level of removal to avoid hitting the loud brass notes and then some level of manual removal on my part when I clean something up for public consumption. Even near-mint 78s often have dozens of clicks that require manual removal.

Regarding tracking of the SG, my only real reference is other 78 cartridges, which I don't think put up much of a fight compared to high-end MCs and MIs. I haven't noticed any obvious defects regarding velocity, either. As I've said, it's often the high-end moving magnet that has the problems that the SG doesn't. 

I use both cartridges with Dynavector DV505 tonearms, which help a lot with the movement in the vertical plane that 78s often have. The massive main arm prevents unwanted movement in the horizontal plane. Tracking has been generally great with both cartridges.

Someday I'd like to get and compare a few higher-end MC or MI 78 cartridges that can track at at least 4+ grams, especially something where you could realistically own and maintain numerous without breaking the bank too badly.

More to discover