Thanks Map, glad the tubes are doing the thing for you. I have also been tempted to try the Harmonic line of cables as well, but really, I have a hard time messing with cables. I guess when you find something that works so well, why change it? Tim
Ohm Walsh Micro Talls: who's actually heard 'em?
Hi,
I'd love to hear the impressions of people who've actually spent some time with these speakers to share their sense of their plusses and minuses. Mapman here on Audiogon is a big fan, and has shared lots on them, but I'm wondering who else might be familiar with them.
I'd love to hear the impressions of people who've actually spent some time with these speakers to share their sense of their plusses and minuses. Mapman here on Audiogon is a big fan, and has shared lots on them, but I'm wondering who else might be familiar with them.
2,916 responses Add your response
Whoops, sorry. The correct name of the store on ebay I referenced above is "essentialhifitweak", not "Essential Audio Tweaks" as I indicated. http://stores.ebay.com/essentialhifitweak I have found their stufff to offer good value and their descriptions of how the products I have bought sound to be reasonable and accurate. |
Frazeur1, I decided to first try tubes I could walk into Guitar Center down the road and buy for $20 each first. The Groove Tube Gold 12AX7s I bought solved the problem. Also, surprisingly, I am hard pressed to hear a difference from teh previous ARC stock tubes that came in the SP16. Perhaps a tad more background noise in the phono section, but nothing of any consequence. So far, I do not feel a need to order tubes from ARC. I could still decide to do that and keep these as an extra set, but I cannot justify it currently. I picked up the 1m MIT terminator ICs on Ebay several years back for <$50 each, as I recall. I also bought a pair of .5 m Harmonic Tech ICs from the Essential Audio Tweaks store on ebay for much more along with the DNM Resons, which were comparable to the MITs in price more or less. All of these are good but different with different strengths and weaknesses. |
Map, have you looked into ordering a set of new tubes for your ARC? I know there are a lot of folks that tube-roll with that preamp, but even a new set from ARC might just take those pains away! Also, where did you come across your MIT cables if I might ask? Always wanted to try a set of them, but have been really pleased with my DH Labs cables so far. Tim |
Things have been mostly stable over the past year with my gear. I have fought some noise issues relating to aging tubes in the ARC pre-amp and some apparent RF noise issues relating to the use of the DNM Reson ICs with the BC Ref1000ms. Now, with six new Groove Tube 12AX7s in the ARC and with MIT Terminator IC in place of the DNM, things are well tuned once again. The Super Walsh 2 100S3s have pushed things to the highest level in years in my wife's always acoustically troublesome sunroom. My Dynaudio monitors are sounding fantastic, better than ever, in my small office room where the gear is located. The F5s pretty much do all that is possible in my bigger, L shaped main listening room. I've also experimented back and forth with tube and SS mhdt DACs in the system. The SS Constantine is doing all I could ask for there currently and has found its home there. The MIT networked ICs seem to be an ideal match for the BEl Canto ref1000m. I read MIT wires are exclusively recommended for Spectron Class D amps. There may be a synergy in general between the MIT wires and Class D switching amps from what I hear. |
" I never feel bad when I return home and fire up my Ohms" Over the past year, I've heard quite a few speakers, including some Tannoys, Maggie 1.7's, and a few Linn models. I never feel bad when I get home, either. It's nice to be able to enjoy speakers without feeling the need to upgrade. Except maybe the x000 series. |
Just an update on my first anniversary of deciding to keep the Walsh 2000s. Over the year, I have made numerous improvements to my system. I have added a new DAC (K-Works SupperBerry, a highly modded Beresford DAC), new digital cable, new preamp (McIntosh C220), custom cradle bases for the Ohms, and had my vintage Thorens 'table modified and fitted with a new cartridge (Denon DL-160). In each case, the 2000s allowed me to clearly hear the differences before and after. Even the difference in the upgraded digital cable, which I thought I would never be able to hear, was clearly and dramatically resolved by the Ohms. I went from a $20 digital cable to a $300 digital cable (K-Works Goldenheart Digital), and I can honestly say it was worth it. In fact, there is almost no comparison between the sound I was getting a year ago and the sound I am getting today. It is miles better! The 2000s continue to delite and amaze me, and I am sure that future upgrades in associated gear will yield even more improvements. I have been a member of the local audio club for about two years now, and have heard many different systems and speakers, some costing many multiples of the 2000s. While I have heard some great sound at these meetings, I never feel bad when I return home and fire up my Ohms. Of course, all these systems sound different, but as my electronics and cables have improved, I have narrowed the gap with those mega-buck systems considerably. Kudos to John and his employees at Ohm - they have made it possible for me to enjoy champagne on a beer budget! |
Christmas bump for my fovorite thread of all time! Many thanks to all of the contributors to this thread- especially the Ohm-owners who have influenced me over the past couple of years. To everyone- may you share your love of music and the joy you have from your systems with your families and friends this Holiday system, in safety and in comfort. For me- I'm Ohm for the Holidays ;P -S |
Yep Bond, I think I discussed your MWT's awhile back ago with you. Your comments as well as many others here prompted my decision to go into the whole surround thing and give it a try. But I am just as impressed with these using them as front L/R speakers for the moment. Just very fun and engaging to listen to. Feels like you are right at the edge of the stage(if not on it) with the performers! Tim |
Well, I took advantage of John's sale, received my Ohm MWT/omni's yesterday. Thanks John! I am in the process of running them in now, just driving them as 2-channel speakers, but they will end up being used as surrounds in my Ohm-Theater. Initial thoughts, I am liking these as stereo speakers very much, even if they aren't necessarily intended for use this way. But I say, who cares? They have a very smooth treble response even in the omni mode, and they do spread a very wide stage of course. Bass is very good for a small cabinet, and I am sure it will only get better. I do think these are going to make an excellent surrounds for me in my room. Will give some more details later on as things break in. Probably write a mini-review when I have time, but that will be later on for sure. Tim |
Thanks for posting info about the sale! I placed my order with John today for the 5000 upgrade for my Walsh 4's. Very exciting, although John informed me that due to the number of people that took advantage of the sale I wouldn't be receiving my upgrade until after the holidays. In the meantime I have my newly refoamed Walsh 4 drivers to tide me over. I'm looking forward to hearing the difference that 26 years of fine tuning will make with my speakers. Congratulations to John and the team at Ohm Acoustics for the success of this sale. More people need to know about your excellent speakers. |
An email I received from John Strohbeen: We've never done this before; but... If you are ready to order speakers or upgrades, give me a call and we will make a deal if at all possible. I'll be in the office most of Friday and Saturday to take calls. If you get no answer, please try later; I'm going to be the only one here. Everyone else is on Thanksgiving Holiday. Have a Happy Thanksgiving! John Strohbeen 800-783-1553 |
I just found this thread and had to voice my experiences with Ohm speakers. My first experience with anything Ohm happened around 1974 when I purchased a pair of Infinity Monitor speakers. These speakers used an inverted Ohm tweeter, a mini Ohm speaker (maybe 3 inches tall?) mounted upside down. The only problem is I kept blowing them. The guy at the stereo place was getting tired of replacing the drivers and offered to let me try out some Ohm F's. I take them home and set them up (I had no idea what I was doing). I had a Phase Linear 400 amp that I drove them with. They sounded very good but seemed like they were missing something so I took them back and got the other speakers. As soon as I got back and hooked those up and turned them on, I knew immediately I had made a big mistake. The Ohms were far superior. Not only that, there isn't a more fun speaker to watch work!!! :-) The mid 80's rolled around and I started moving to CD's. I needed a new stereo setup since my old one was long gone. So I purchased a pair of Walsh 4's and a Carver M1.5t amp and 4000t preamp. It was like a match made in heaven. The Walsh 4's could take just about anything the M1.5t could throw at them (I would routinely push 500 - 600 watts per channel at them) without strain. I was reading here about the lack of low bass punch with Ohms. Ohms need power and lots of it. To get an Ohm to open up and sound like they should requires good clean power. My 4's are currently sitting in storage with blown drivers (thanks to my kids when they were younger) awaiting the new Walsh 5 upgrade. In the mean time I've had 2 pairs of Walsh 2's in my living room. While they don't have the same punch or tonal quality as the 4's, they sound excellent. At first they sounded a little muffeled until I got brave enough to crank in the power. Once I did, the memories of the 4's started coming back. While they can't handle the power and start to sound strained when really pushed, I've listened to high quality recordings at natural levels with them and they are very easy to listen to. The sound stage is vintage Ohm with everything placed precisely. I blew one of the 2's by accident. My receiver was out for repair and I use the Carver M1.5t for the front channels. I had a direct connection from my laptop to the amp when the mini stereo plug fell out. The amp graciously allocated all of it's power to that speaker and... well, just say Walsh 2's don't like 750 watts at once. But all is not lost, just ordered another pair of Walsh 2's off of eBay for $240 until I can save up for my Walsh 5000 upgrade. But based on what I've heard, I won't be changing speaker brands, I love my Ohm's! |
BTW, after bringing in the 100S3s and later the 5S3s, the only part of my system at the time that did not change as well towards the goal of optimizing performance was my Linn Axis turntable, speaker wires and Denon103R cart. Everything else changed including amp (twice), pre-amp + phono pre-amp, DAC and ICs. So pretty much nothing remained the same. But it was all worth it..... |
YEs, I find with the OHMs, it is much like making really good soup. All the ingredients matter and attention to detail 9and some patience) is the key to getting really good results. Foster, I know all teh gyrations you have gone through so I am very happy that your patience and attention to detail appears to be paying off. |
Foster - I couldn't agree more! I was gradually upgrading my electronics and cables, and eventually realized that I had taken my old speakers as far as they could go. In the year that I've had the Walsh 2000s, I have made some upgrades - a new DAC, moddified my turntable, a new cartridge, and a new preamp. In each case, the 2000s revealed the differences. Although I am really enjoying my system right now, I agree with you that I can only benefit from further system improvements. Don't worry about that dealer; I bet he'd say that about any speaker he didn't carry. People who discredit Ohm products either haven't heard them or haven't heard them in a good system that is well set up. Even people who have had Ohms in the past and moved on generally speak highly of Ohm's speakers. Interestingly, John Strohbeen told me that he does not do trade shows for that very reason - too little time to do it right and show his products properly. John S. really has a talent for voicing loudspeakers. All we consumers have to do is add the right electronics, cables and a proper set up to benefit more fully from this talent! |
I haven't posted to this thread for a while as I've been changing components over (and over again) the past year. I have Ohm Walsh 5000 prototypes in 5-S3 cabinets. It has been months of changing out electronics, cables etc. and listening to get to this point. More than once, I thought I knew what the Ohms were capable of; The Ohms proved me wrong. In my experience, they have more to offer as you match your gear and move up the electronics food chain. They are very neutral speakers. My Ohms have been much like the proverbial "chameleon." The quality of their sound has changed and improved as the system of electronics in front of them has been optimized. Others, (Mapman) have noted that Ohms have the ability to be better with better gear. As I have matched and upgraded electronics, cables, and even my ac outlet, the sound of the Ohms improved in quality too. I spoke to a very high end dealer once who bluntly stated "you need different speakers." That's been a recurring theme I've read and heard. I don't know about older Ohm models, but the modern Ohms are quality. There is a lesson I have learned. System building takes more patience than I like. Seems that sometimes it takes more time, trial and error than I wanted to deal with. I didn't know these speakers could be this good but I continued to experiment with different electronics, power cords etc. As I went through component changes, I thought the sound of the Ohms was improving but realized it was still unsatisfying. I practically gave up. But, I learned that you have to stick with speakers sometimes and continue to experiment upstream. One find along the way was Auricle Audio interconnects. They are great and a bargain! The other find was the Maestro ac outlet some of you have read about. Each of these has contributed to the enhanced performance of the Ohm speakers in my system. The sound quality of the Ohms can go where you take them. |
I owned the Walsh 5 S3 and upgraded to the 5000s and have extensive listening hours logged with both. Here is a point by point comparison: 1. 5000 greatest improvement is in the midrange - it is much more open and transparent - superb inner detail and quiet background - much more dimensional. 2. 5000 has lower SPL, ~2 dB, needs more power and a good 200W per channel amp - and has a superior bass with better slam, tightness and extension - quite amazing actually. All the Walshs had excellent bass but the 5000 has hit the sweet spot with just perfect box tuning. 3. The 5000 treble is very airy and sweet and never ever will you hear grain or grit - hours and hours of listening pleasure and zilch fatigue. 4. The soundstage of the 5000 goes deeper with much better fleshing out of the back rows of the ensemble and much more hall acoustic and you-are-there presence. The 5000 upgrade from the Walsh 5 Series 3 is well worth the dollar investment and heartily recommended. |
Hey the nice GP DDD speakers are back up for sale now for about the cost of a new pair of 5000s. I wish I lived close enough to the seller to give a listen. GPs |
WG, I the grand scale of things, your asking price is very favorable. There is no speaker I know of capable of more at anywhere near that price point. There are decent monitors, but these compete with fullranges and the OHMs play with the best IMHO. The challenge with the OHM Walshes from a sellers perspective I think is that many see older OHM Walshes out there for under $1000 these days and are not aware of the differences in performance between old and new OHM Walshes. The cans and cabinets all tend to look similar, more so than most designs, so I think it is important to make sure prospective buyers know exactly what they are getting, a speaker that in most rooms competes with the best out there, and not a 30 year old less refined design. |
Hi mapman. Thanks for asking. I love these speakers, but a surprise impending divorce forces me generate cash right now. I'm also trying to sell Grado cart ai love. And I may have to sell the Yamaha M-85, which I'm trying to forestall. When all this is done and finances recover I'll be back in the Ohm Walsh customer base. |
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This is interesting. GP DDD speakers can't possibly go for much lower than this can they? GPs for sale |
Maybe I was spoiled? Funny, but the soundstage aspects of the Walsh 2000s that I bought last year were not what made them keepers for me. Sure, the soundstage is huge and holographic, but properly set up (which mine were), the Vandersteen 1Cs I had before also could do some amazing things with soundstage reproduction. As a result, the first thing I noticed when I fired up the Ohms was not a bigger soundstage, but an amazing truth in timbre that the 1Cs lacked. Now, I have heard many loudspeakers that tend to bunch the sound around each speaker. If you are used to that kind of soundstage, then, heck yeah, the Ohms will knock you out of your chair with their soundstage abilities. As time has passed, I have noticed some differences in the soundstage: Overall, the soundstage is not as far into the room as was the Vandys, different, not better or worse. That said, I think the Ohms do a better job of reflecting what is in the recording, soundstage-wise. The Vandys, I think, kind of created a lot of soundstage fireworks, whether they were on the record or not. Interestingly, the new McIntosh preamp has changed the soundstage presentation of the 2000s. Mostly for the better, with a little more forwardness in the presentation, and a bit more depth. |
Its true that omni speakers produce a distinctly different class of sound that can wow people immediately regardless because the presentation is so inherently unique. Most may never bother or feel need to move forward from their initial setup at that point I would imagine because they have already accomplished a major change for the better in their sound that is hard to match otherwise. |
I'm sure that the "jaw drop" thing was a response to the omni presentation. You'll get that effect straight away and it does make its mark. It's only after you "listen through" that striking first impression that you get to things like dynamics, tonal balance et. al. I suspect that most listeners will find the Ohms really impressive at first listen, even if they're poorly matched in a system. If they're well matched, then you've got a good thing going for the long term. Just speculating. Marty |
" his experience runs a little counter to posts in this thread about the need for high current to really make them sing. What to make of this?" You may not be pushing the limits of volume and dynamics possible with the OHMs with a Fisher tube receiver, but the end results might still be quite pleasant. I lot of people run OHMs off of gear that is perhaps less than optimal and remain quite satisfied. Its all relative. |
If anyone is looking for an outstanding high power amplifier to pair with their Ohm's see the class d amp kits at classdaudio.com. These kits are ridiculously cheap for the quality of amplification you get. I put together their 250w Super D amp to pair with my Ohm's and I could not be happier. If you have basic soldering skills you can put this amp together. No affiliation with the company, just seriously impressed with the sound quality of this amp for the $500 total in kit and parts. |
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Thoughts you guys might find this review on Audio Asylum interesting: http://www.AudioAsylum.com/cgi/vt.mpl?f=speakers&m=297309 |
Bondmap, I have gone through various 5.1 and 7.1 configurations for the sides and rears, trying combinations of the Super 2's, the 100 S3 omnis, the mini-micro omni's, bipoles, dipoles, and three sets of direct radiators. For my money, there is no substitute for 7.1 if you want a full soundfield back there. |