Good to read that ARC took care of you and that you are back on track - tattooedtrackman.
Happy Listening!
Happy Listening!
Problem with brand new black ARC Ref 6
I thought i would write telling you about my experience when i purchased my brand new black ARC Ref 6 preamp about a month ago. It was working fine for a few days and then when i went to press the tube hours on the remote to display on the preamp the unit would cut off, or go to a different auxiliary. It would not happen all the time but often enough to know something was not right. I contacted ARC personally about this and Evan from ARC said it could be the remote. He said to bring it to my ARC dealer that i had bought it from and try his remote from his Ref 6. Same results as before. I was very disappointed as this did not solve the problem. I called Evan again and told him it still was malfunctioning. He said he never ever heard of this problem before and asked me if i wanted a new preamp and said he was so sorry about that. Since it was being returned i asked him if i could get the natural silver instead of the black he said no problem . Within about a week or so my new ARC Ref came to my dealer and all is fine with this one. I just want to say that dealing with ARC they are awesome and second to none with dealing with a problem. They take care of their customers with the very best and professionalism one could ever ask for from a company. Could not be happier !!!! Also i am in NJ and my ARC dealer is Audio Connection in Verona... John is the owner and he is an awesome guy in the business.Knows his components inside and out... I have been dealing with them since 1990 when i first bought my Counterpoint SA 220 amp and SA 2000 preamp. He is and was always there for me with any questions or concerns or problems. Truly old school. Thank you Evan from ARC and John from Audio Connection !!!!!!!!!
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REF5se from new 2011 ( if memory serves ) from Robert Taylor of Taylor House in NC robert would burn in, operate and look over every bit of gear going thru his shop - before delivery to customer - OCD Engineer and Music Lover - wishing him well in retirement!! anyway - probably jinx myself but no issues in something like 4 K hours of listening ( time to check hours ) |
@/tattooedtrackman Is the Krell a SS amp? If so, that might explain the difference. Also, the ARC Ref 150SE (a tube amp) may just require more juice to drive it to enjoyable listening levels. I have an old Radio Shack SPL meter. Might be a good time to start using it again. Thanks for reminding me to check. BIF |
@bifwynne ..... Dont mean to scare you... Im also using XLR Bal output ...Krell FPB 600 amp...B&W Matrix 800s. Rega Isis cdp.XLR interconnects. Im telling you my average volume id say is at 25 and ill tell you thats loud.!!!...And im a classic rock guy...I never ever had to go past 30 with the volume.. And i love loud classic rock music but i listen to a wide variety also. Also i dont use the stock PC for the 6.. I use a Shunyata King Cobra cx PC . For my amp i use a Shunyata Sigma HC PC. And for my CDP a Shunyata Sigma digital PC. |
@tattooedtrackman - Yeah, that is the volume off the XLR/BAL Main #1 output. Do you use the XLR/BAL output or the SE output for ur amp?? What model is ur amp? Ur scaring me. Hope I am not hurting my ears. Never thought I was driving my rig that hard. |
@bifwynne .......... Yes after about 2 plus years i cant see any bugs in your 6 now. I doubt you will have any problems with it and dont ever need your warranty.. Im glad to hear that...You also stated that you run your 6 between 35 and 40 clicks ? Is that the volume? If it is all i can say is wow..I run my 6 at 23- 28 maybe 30 on some cd recordings and ill tell you that even on 23 that is loud on my rig... I cant even imagine what 35 - 40 would be. lol |
@folkfreak, I recall that my Ref CD-8 output is 4 volts. That is way too much voltage for my amp. Unitary would be terrible. So here, the Ref 6 would attenuate the voltage. I do not know what the output voltage is for my phone pre. I usually run my Ref 6 between 35 and 40 clicks for both my CD and phone pre. My speakers are pretty sensitive (92db) and I do not need to push my electronics. I was fooling around with my new Ref 6 today and pushed the SPLs way beyond what I should have. My ears need a day or two to recover. |
Re unitary gain -- ideally you should operate your pre amp as close to unitary gain (1:1) as possible i.e. avoiding active amplification and avoiding excessive use of the volume control. To the extent you can manage gain upstream of the amp you'll find it better if you do this then if you send in too small a signal (and have to up the volume into the 6-12dB of available gain) or if you have to run the volume control at <30 on the 110 point setting. In my experience the range 40-60 (or 70) sounds best. ps this will also obviate any risk in excessive gain in switching between sources, or inadvertently activating the pass through |
@tattooedtrackman: "Warranty states in owners manual that it is limited to the original purchaser . And a photo copy of the dated purchase receipt. I do not think if you buy a unit second hand they will honor the limited warranty." I am sure you are correct, but I bought my demo unit from an authorized ARC dealer. Per ARC, I step into his shoes and take the balance of the dealer's warranty. In my case, ... about 10 months. Hopefully, I will never need it. Have read some other threads where one or two folks had a problem. I surmise that after 2+ years and 610 hours, if there was a bug, it would have presented itself by now. As to your other point re the unitary pass-thru, ... please forgive me if I do not test what you just wrote. lol BIF |
Just picked up a dealer demo Ref 6 with 610 hours on it and some original ARC warranty remaining. Still getting used to the remote. I hope my wife never throws the metal remote at me. Darn thing is heavy. So far I think I am ok with the unit. I have owned many ARC units over the years and have never had a problem, except for blown biasing resisters when I ran 6550 power tubes that arced in my amps (VS 115 and old Ref 150). My Ref 150SE uses KT 150 tubes which are very robust and so far, no problems with arcing. Must say that I am surprised to even see a thread like this. ARC is OCD about QC. It is surprising indeed to read that any modern units have failed. I guess sh*t just happens. BIF P.S. - if I read the Ref 6 manual correctly, there is a setting that provides for unit pass-through volume. If that is so, fellow Ref 6 owners should be careful to never hit that setting. You'll likely blow your amp and speakers. |
@theo ......... Yes 3 does seem excessive. I just hope that i will have no new problems with my Ref 6. And if God forbid i do at least i bought it brand new and have a 3 yr warranty. And at least i know i will be taken care of with no problem. My only other components that are worth mentioning was my Counterpoint SA 220 amp that i bought brand new in 1990 and which that had the mosfet problems which my left channel went out and could not be repaired. And as we all know what happened with Counterpoint going under. Also own Krell FPB 600 amp i bought used and have it for years now and is still running strong. Also had Mark Levinson preamps used and also never had a problem with them. As far as ARC goes they are incredible sounding gear and as long as their customer service stands by you i will never give up on them. That really means alot to me. |
Tattooed, I agree it seemed a bit much for one guy to have these issues on the only components I have owned from one manufacturer. It was frustrating at first because I have been a McIntosh guy for years and switching was hard. The new "dead" unit was almost enough to make me turn away. But I can honestly express that I am glad I stayed the course. And dealing with ARC has been positive enough that I can appreciate that occasionally one get thru Quality Control although 3 for one customer seems excessive, I have to maybe examine my karma. In all the years of quite a few McIntosh units I think the only one I had issue with was bought used and that was the only used one I had bought. But they stepped up and repaired it at no cost. Funny thing was when I told them I bought it used, the Mc Rep asked if the unit was where I could look at it, I replied yes. He said to look closely at the front plate and see if if it said McIntosh, I said yes, he said send it to me here is your RA. |
I had 2 used ARC preamps one was a Ref 5se and the other was a Ref 6 i bought on AG , both used. The used Ref 5se worked flawless. I sold that on AG to buy a used Ref 6 on AG. That unit i had a problem with it as it kept shutting off after a few min. I contacted the seller i bought it from and i got a full refund. But instead of sending it back to the seller who was in Calif, John the owner of Audio Connection in Verona NJ who is also an ARC dealer took the unit and had it fixed and also resold it on AG for the seller in Calif which was a great idea.So that worked out great for me and the seller. John from Audio Connection will go way out of his way for his customers. He is extremely knowledgeable and really an old school audio guy. If you live in and around NJ or in the tri state area i highly recommend going to his store and seeing him and talking to him if you are in the market for audio equipment. Like i said i go back with dealing with John for about 30 yrs. So then i went through John to buy my brand new ARC Ref 6 , i wanted it in black and had to wait for it to be built about 3 weeks. When that came in after about 20 hrs of use the unit would malfunction when i hit the tube hour display from the remote. It would either shut right off or go to a different Aux . I contacted John and spoke to Evan from ARC who suggested it might be the remote and to try and see if i could borrow Johns remote from his Ref 6 and see if it was that. I did that and still had the same problem. I contacted Evan again and told him i still had the problem and he said i will send you a brand new black Ref 6 to John from Audio Connection and to just return the defective black 6 when the new one comes in to pick it up i can just bring the defective one back to John and take the new one which also had to be made up in about 2 weeks..Right before the new black 6 unit was almost ready to ship from ARC i changed my mind about the color and decided to go with the natural silver instead of the black. I called Evan from ARC and asked him if it was to late to change the color. He said the unit was ready to be shipped that day and as long as it was not shipped out yet he could change the panels for me to silver. Once again ARC went out of their way for me to make a customer happy. There customer service was excellent and will go way beyond for any concerns requests or problems you may have. I now have the brand new Ref 6 in natural color with about 5 hrs on it and i can not be happier. My hat goes off to Audio Connection ( John) and ARC (Evan) |
ARC makes some very nice sounding gear, I have owned about 5 or 6 of their units over the years. And they have very good customer service. But the stuff is not dependable, and the cost of ownership is high. Constant failures and expensive repairs, along with the hassles of shipping the stuff back to Minnesota. I gave up on it. PIA to own. |
@jafant ......Yes i thought it was a good idea to start a thread and post what i experienced with dealer / retailer . To me there aint a fraction of dealers -brick and mortar stores like they used to be in the 80s- 90s like i remembered when i first got in to high end audio. I go back almost 30 yrs with the owner John from Audio Connection in Verona NJ. And the only thing that changed with us is all the grey in our hair. It was like seeing a old friend after 30 yrs. |
@theo .......... Wow thats something ......Expecially about the LS26 arrived dead with no sound. Then you mentioned that after they sent you the new LS26 you had problems with the mute circuit? And on your Ref 5 a power circuit board issue? It seems to amaze me about these problems expecially after seeing the ARC video on utube on the making of their components and the testing they do before getting sent out. But like you mentioned maybe we also pay more for quality high end gear and the price does include excellent service and like you said needs to be factored in... |
Actually I had two problems with the LS26, first unit arrives dead with no sound. After speaking with them on the phone they next day aired one with a call tag for the one I had. Then I had a number of issues with the "mute" circuit not un-muting without power off/on cycling. The dealer tried replacing the mute relay 2-3 times and I finally told him that I wanted it sent back to ARC. They received it and determined that the board was bad and just sent out a new unit which was actually a review unit as they were just starting to build the LS27. I kept it for years as I realized that the later production unit had benefited from some updates, my other unit was 35 months old and almost out of warranty. On the REF5, I had a power circuit board issue and they just replaced the board. All of my experience in dealing with ARC has been handled with the attitude that a music lover cannot be with out his music and they don't want to be the obstacle preventing that from happening. I have to add that I have really had pretty good experiences with most audio manufacturers with the exception on one or two. It seems like maybe we pay more than we should for good gear but the price includes good service and that needs to be factored in when considering the cost. |