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System too bassy - Primaluna & Usher

I'm looking for advice on how to tame my bass. Since upgrading my amp to the Primaluna Dialogue One from a low end Harmon Kardon, I've noticed my fatigue level from the bass has shortened my listening times drastically. That could also be because listening levels are higher because of the increased power. Regardless, I would like to tame the bass which these Ushers are known for.

THE SETUP:

Lossless Files
Apple TV > unknown decent quality optical cable to...
Rega Dac > low end Monster RCA cable to
Primaluna Dialogue One > $3 ft speaker cable to
Usher Be-718 speakers
VTI Metal stands

The room is 12' X 13' with one side open concept into the rest of the condo. The wall that the system is against is actually a couple of feet shorter because of the HVAC system, which puts one speaker in a corner.

I just got the Primaluna amp and I love the Ushers and do really like the Rega Dac. So I'm not willing to change those.

MY THOUGHTS:

I'm thinking of interconnects, speaker cables and room acoustics. I think room acoustics is a must regardless. Perhaps I do that first, then look at the total sound.

What are your thoughts?
deetothevee
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,182 posts
 
Probably a lot of room acoustics involved. Moving the speakers 2-3 feet or more out away from the walls, especially the front wall, and corner(s) should help tame the bass I would think. Should also help with imaging and soundstage. Experiment with teh speakers at different locations. Even subtle changes in location can have a big effect on bass.

ALso how high off the floor are the speakers? If closer to the floor, getting them up higher on a good pair of rigid massive stands might help.

Toeing in speakers so tweets face more towards primary listening position might also help tilt the tonality in the direction desired away from more bass.
mapman's avatar
mapman
22,182 posts
 
If options for locating the speakers to help tame bass are not practical or sufficient, and speakers must remain closr to walls and corners, then adding bass traps to the corner(s) is another thing to try.

Only after all practical placement and treatment options are exhausted would I start to think about changing anything. Some different ICs/wires might produce some change as well, but I would not rely on those as a primary solution to address bass issues.

A 250w/ch or so Class D amplifier might be an option to consider if all else fails to get that particular tube amp and speaker combo sounding the way you want. Tube amps and smaller speaekrs/monitors like those that attempt to deliver extended bass out of a small box/package is often not the ideal combo, but addressing room acoustics first in various ways as described to the extent practical might help to make things work out better.
newbee
4,767 posts
 
Location, location, location! Don't spend a dime on 'stuff' until you have set up your speakers and listening chair as best possible. There have been a lot of posts on 'proper set up' and should be in the archives, both here and on AudioAsylum. Putting the speakers against the wall and or/a corner ALONE (And it appears you have done both!) could be causing your problem, but placing your listening chair is very important as well. Locating it in a bass node could cause excessive bass, albeit over a small frequency range.

Another issue to consider it the tubes you are using on the Primaluna, both small and large(power) tubes, which can make a big difference. FWIW if you haven't already tried them try some good linear 6550's or 6l6GC's, especially the latter if you want less bass but a good linear tone. I've used SED's and they are not fat! You might also try some Sovtek 12AX7LPS which have a fine mid-range and HF tone but are also not fat in the bass.
mattmiller's avatar
mattmiller
1,497 posts
 
You have to get rid of those cheap cables and get something more solid core ..NOT stranded monster cable! ... THIS will make the biggest improvement in tightning up that bloated non defined bass you speak of. Dont even think about tube rolling until you fix this first. I would try Kimber,Morrow Audio, Nordost. Your speakers are awesome, hook them up with proper set of Bi-wires from Morrow Audio and your jaw will drop.Get a really nice Digital cable from SIGNALCABLE.com . Get some Morrow skr cable and A pair of Interconnects from the dac from Morrow as well . Pay for the break in and get some of the most amazing TRANSPARENT cables you will not be sorry.
deetothevee OP
44 posts
 
Thank you everyone! In regards to positioning, I can play with toe in some more and see if that makes a difference. But I'm very limited in changing positioning, this set up is in my living room in my condo with my lady. It's already a blessing she's ok with having the primaluna on display on top of our fireplace unit. Needless to say, changing positioning is not an option.

I actually have a set of Sovtek tubes that I haven't tried yet that came with the amp. I'll have to check what kind they are.

My stands are 24 inches high. I plan to eventually get the RWS 708 Usher stands which should tighten the bass and is adjustable.

Great ideas!!

Mattmiller -
Are those brands you mentioned known for reducing bass? I do love sweet midrange which is why I got the speakers and amp. So I don't want to lose that. I like more bass but just not too much. Also, what are your thoughts on Audioquest products? SO you think transparent cables is my answer? Not looking for cables that "reduce" bass?

You mentioned bi-wiring. Isn't that only possible when you have 2 amps? I have an integrated.
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