Vinyl vs. CD

Hi Albert; We were posting at the same time so I missed your well written statement above. I respect your views as much as anyone on this forum, and I have no doubt that your state of the art analog rig sounds better than my "quite good" digital one. As stated above I could not listen past the noise of the modest vinyl rig I tried-- further, I am very happy with my CD based system. Vinyl lovers seem to think they are the only ones committed to working at getting the most music out of their systems as possible, and with this I partly disagree. While maybe less work, I have installed dedicated AC and ground systems, spent 61 days placing speakers within room, built a 200 lb. stereo stand with many audiophile features, addressed vibration control, upgraded power cords (and all wires), and purchased the best quality digital front end that I can afford. I continue to try promising "tweaks" and enjoy doing it. BTW, it took me a month working 1/2 days just to build my stereo stand. My point is that there is much that the digital user can do to improve the musicality of his system too. Finally, I say again, your state of the art analog system undoubtedly "sounds" better than my CD based rig, and I would love to hear your system, but weighing every experience I can, I get a great deal of enjoyment out of the music system that I have (so maybe it's best that I don't hear your system), and for me that's enough. Cheers. Craig.

........forgot to mention all the room acoustic treatments I've done-- spent much time and money doing it too. I do not intend to get involved in a long unresolvable disagreement between the virtues of vinyl and digital-- and I don't think Albert does either. In fact, I'll give up right now and go play my new Cowboy Junkies CD "Waltz Across America", respectfully, and cheers. Craig.

Albert - it is an undiluted pleasure to read your posts as your dedication to the hobby obviously seeks to make the equipment servant to the music. And this is what this pursuit is ultimately about. Not only are your views hewn by years of experience, they are always models of balance and tolerance. And this is another attribute that makes this hobby an uplifting experience. CD's are symptomatic of our "hamburger culture" - they require minimal effort to acquire, use and maintain. However, we have to go to extraordinary lengths to make them listenable - akin "to polishing a turd". Many of us have unwillingly fallen victim to this flawed format (I, myself, readily admit to a CD collection of 4000+), precisely because the market and our hectic lifestyles have dictated this. For many of us, it is more desirable to have flawed sound than none at all.

Well, Garfish, your phrase "I was aware of the stylus dragging across the grooves" mirrors my experience precisely. And, yes, even with the so-called audiophile HQ 180gm pressings, cleaned so meticulously I could clearly see the frown on my face. But.........unlike yourself, I am a stubborn SOB who kinda refuses to give up easily. I've thrown wads of cash at the problem, have attempted to educate myself every which way, and still cringe helplessly when reading things like the above posts, where promises of audio and sonic nirvana are offered through "proper" analog rigs. Well, my analog rig is about as "proper" (+3k) as it's going to get. But after 3 tables, 5 cartridges, 2 phono stages etc. the buck(s) stops here. Now I need to figure out if there is something wrong with me or all those vinylphiles out there. If the goal of high end audio is the recreation or approximation of the "original event" it seems fairly obvious that this is impossible to achieve via vinyl. The onslaught of surface noise - forgot the pops and ticks - obviates any benefit of more "natural" sound. What can possibly do a better job at reminding you that you are not in the presence of the real thing than record surface noise? And if that NOISE is sufficiently objectionable, who gives a fig about things like soundstaging and proper imaging? The mood and the moment have already been annihilated. But I've got a lot of vinyl, much of which is not replaceable, or that I will not replace. So.....the beat goes on. Now, if there was just some way I can enjoy the MUSIC - at least as much as I did as a kid listening to a transistor radio - and forget about the EQUIPMENT, gee, now that would really be priceless. By the way, Garfish, where was this place you dumped your vinyl............?

jeez, i have a decent vinyl rig, but by no means anywhere near the top of the food-chain, at least as far as price goes! ;~) while i *do* get some unwanted noise on some of my discs in less-than-pristine condition, for the most part, it isn't a problem. and, while i *can* set-up a turntable, i don't have all kindsa fancy test equipment to aid me. while i have grown-up w/vinyl, i've listened to enuff cd's, and had enuff folks hear my set-up that are mainly familiar w/only cd's, to know that noise ain't an issue w/properly set-up vinyl. i gotta weigh in w/albert p on this one. my vinyl-cleaning regimen consists mostly of a dish-soapy sponge w/warm water, & a keith monks record-sweeper, which keeps the grooves clean & static-free, by tracking along w/the record - from the other side of the table, of course! ;~) doug