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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
phildsp
2 posts
 
Thanks for the answers guys. Yeah, maybe that's the best plan: to use Janzten Cross-Caps for example as the basis for the woofer LP filter and bypass with a Clarity MR. A few designers warn against mixing types but probably for a low freq LP filter you're not going to get pronounced adverse effects even if you're looking for near audio perfection.

Even though the MR's might not have the superior tone and natural dynamics of the Dueland Cast caps, are they possibly in the same league in terms of imaging detail and sound stage size?
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Phildsp

That is one thing we all have to do is figure the best bang for our $. I think there is a lot more info out on this subject (of caps and I think them huge) then there was even a couple of years ago.

It can also be cheaper and better to change the caps in speakers or electronics rather than constant new gear, if you can figure out what does what.
face
516 posts
 

08-27-09: Phildsp
Even though the MR's might not have the superior tone and natural dynamics of the Dueland Cast caps, are they possibly in the same league in terms of imaging detail and sound stage size?
In my experience, it's very close. CAST's are a little more transparent though.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I have often heard the difference from vintage to modern tube amps is the freq extreme's.

I think that goes directly to the vintage caps. They are VERY heavy in the midrange with very little bottom or top end. Some call that more natural. To me it is very lacking on the phono stage for sure. The tricky part is keeping something alive sounding while being full freq.

In Clarity's excellent White paper on caps they did say that 30% of people do like high resonating caps. What this says is that as shocking as it is 30% like "cheap" caps.

Whether it is V-Cap, Mundorf, Clarity or Duelund no one calls them high resonating caps. That is really amazing really. That means 30% would prefer a $1 cap over a $1k cap!

When doing my own tests, for 30 minutes people would pick the vintage caps over the Duelund's in the speakers then after 30 minutes they thought something was broken in the vintage. There must be something that we are either used too or naturally think is good with resonance?

We want the detail but do not want the sound to go thin or dead.

Another side benefit of the Duelund's has been it is obvious and painfully obvious on which LP's are worn. You are not guessing what is wrong.
theaudiotweak
2,801 posts
 
Years ago while upgrading my Dunlavy SC4's the first thing I did was seal the interior walls of the enclosure. Huge difference. Next was to build a multi resistor bridge using Vishay metal film resistors..Huge difference enough to make me wake my daughter and have her listen. Inductors swapped for North Creek 8 and 10 gauge..a little difference. Built multi caps to swap for the stock single value Solens. Things got worse especially in the bass lower mids.

Single upgrade cap in comparison to the same value Solen..the sub cap sounded much better. With that experience in ear and mind I built multi caps stacked all of the same manufacturer type and brand the outcome sounded thin and less involving. Its as if the bass was now combed and filtered ..multifiltered uneven in transistion. All caps were built within 1% of original published/printed Dunlavy values. My experience in this rebuild venture makes me profess the cabinet seal material the resistor bridges as well as the inductors. The multi-cap mis-adventure or by-pass has since made me stay with single cap swaps only..which I feel make for a better listening experience. Thats how I heard things . Tom
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