Should I Upgrade My Krells


Here are the details. I have a Krell 150A Amplifier, Krell 250P Pre-Amplifier, Cary 303/200 CD Player, Vienna Acoustic Bachs, AudioQuest Viper XLRs throughout. Some Very Thick Monster Cable speaker wire (M100 series I think). I bought the Krells off of E-Bay in ABSOLUTE pristine condition 1 1/2 years ago. I will say that my Bachs are HERE TO STAY as I'm a silk dome tweeter fan as well as a Vienna fan! IMHO, nothing sounds better than Vienna. . . again MY personal opinion. Also, the Cary is quite phenominal!!!

When I purchased the Krells on E-Bay, I paid $2,150.00. When new, both units went for $4,800.00.

It has been said that sometimes Krell can be a bit too agressive and that may be true (I don't know with authority). If this is in fact the case, I believe that since the Bachs and Cary are very much laid back, this offsets the brashness of the Krells. I think the Krells do well in producing bass on my Bachs especially since they have no bass driver, but rather are ported on the back. IMHO, I feel as thought the midrage is positively intoxication and the high end can be likened to mercury. If I had one complaint, it would be imaging. I wished that my system was able to do this more effectively!!!

I went to audition the Mozarts side by side to the Bachs at my local Tweeter store. To my amazement, I truly believe the Bachs sounded better! Further, the set up I heard at the store which included B&K electronics and a no name cd player sounded better than my home system???? In short, I experienced far better imaging than my home system???? Can B&K be on the same level as Krell in this aspect?? I know my Cary is not in question as it's about as good as it gets at the price point I paid.

This all being said, should I replace the Krells? I don't want to sacrifice what I already have in Bass, Midrange, and Treble. I want to improve the imaging as I know that can be done and have heard it demonstrated!!

Any advice would be welcomed!

Itch
itch
I tend to doubt the problems you cite are all Krell related.
I'd really work with the cables and speaker positioning before I sell and give up a known quantity, the Krells, for an unknown quantity. I also want to think the old Krell electronics would do almost as well as the new B&k in most areas and exceed them in a few others. That is a hope only however. Would the dealer allow you to take the B&Ks home for a few Sunday night listening sessions perhaps? That way you could get them back to him/her early on the following Mondays and you could take notes in a few leisurely and structured listening sessions...maybe with some well earred friends joining you too. At least try to minimize the number of variables during your comparisons, and your room is probably the biggest variable and the one not closely duplicated at the dealer, before you make a move. When purchasing my most recent set of speakers I noted the dealer room had a serious mid bass hump compared to my listening room. This anomaly was noted in the dealer room 7 years ago with the same speaker. Of course my room might have a suckout alternatively...who knows without measuring devices? The speakers were overly lush at the dealer with Krell or BAT electronics, but less lush at home with Bryston and c-j electronics. A different vintage of Krell electronics was present 7 years ago at the dealer by the way. Imaging was somewhat better at the dealer until I found the best placement. That took no less than seven listening sessions and numerous small speaker movements. Now I think the two are almost equal. Of course the dealer had a much better Cd player (for the price of a good used car) and cables. I DID have the same source material. What you often give up is not missed until the component is long gone....so try to be sure before you dismiss two good mono amps.
I would say yes, replace the Krells. I've never been a Krell fan. I am a fan of Vienna Acoustics however. I've recently sold my Beethovens and my Strauss are due in anyday now. I can't wait. I currently use a Classe CP-60 preamp with a Threshold T400 amp, which I believe is much more musical combo then the Krells. Krell is probably more dynamic and powerful, but too aggressive, and to my ears, a tad harsh. I use Tara Labs Decade cables.
I would think a tubed preamp may allow you to keep the Krell amp and be happy. Audition a Cary, CJ, or BAT to name a few. That may be the easiest way to go.

Regards,
John
I have had several different Krell amps and pre-amps and have not found them to be harsh or overly aggresive. These are words which are typically applied by people who have never owned Krell or have a preconcieved notion of what everything should sound like based on what they currently own. For some reason many people feel the need to denigrate Krell equipment. Maybe if they put it down they will feel better about their equipment.

I will admit that every time I bought a newer piece of Krell it sounded better than the piece it replaced. If a person were comparing their new pre-amp to the older Krell maybe some of these discriptions would apply, but they would not be a criticism as much as a comparision.

I have been ridiculed by certain unnamed members of the AudiogoN community for liking Krell but it was by people whose discussion has proved them to be little more than idiots. Krell makes a good product, but it will not be for everyone. That doesn't make it bad. There are hundreds of appliance makers or auto makers each making different versions of the same thing. It is not the case that only one of them is good and all the others suck.

Based on all of this this or inspite of it there are tons of options for you. I am of the opinion that once your electronics are of a reasonable level cables will make the most obvious and cost effective improvement. Even spending outrageous ammounts of money on cable. The level of improvement is bigger with cables than it is with spending a comparable ammount on electronics. Everyone has their favorite cables. I tend to like Purist and Cardas with the Krell equipment I own.

Best of luck in your search. You will find as many opinions as you find responders to your thread.
The guys at tweeter are pretty cooperative. Why don't you ask them if you can swap your Krells into their setup?

Did you listen to your own CDs or new material?

It is not uncommon to hear differences in imaging characteristics among different speakers of the same line using the same electronics. Smaller speakers with fewer drivers can have better overall coherence and soundstaging but generally at the expense of bass extension.

How much attention have you paid to speaker placement? Are your speakers up against the back wall or out in the room? How far apart are they? This would be the first experiment I would perform.
Get a GamuT D-200 amp, and never look back.
I have a GamuT D-200 driving the Mahlers, and it is remarkable.

KF