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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,511 posts
 
They fell off? Do you mean they broke off from handling? I have had that happen with caps when I was bending the wire leads too much. The thinner gauge silver leads seem more prone to that.

I assume you can get refunded? Perhaps you should call Chris at Jupiter and talk to him. I have installed over 18 of these Jupiter caps with no issues.......knock on wood...
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
I'm considering changing the capacitors in my amplifier's 1st gain stage(associated with the 6em7 driver tube section). The Jupiter Cu foil has my interest(given the praise posted here). However I've been so pleased with the Duelund CAST effect in my DAC and speakers(truly brilliant results). It will be one or the other if I go forward. I suspect that either capacitor will one will be fine.Volleyguy, I'm curious to read your comparison of these two products.
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,511 posts
 
Charles for electronics go with Jupiter. Just better in tube amps and preamps based on my experience as well as at least 5 others who replaced CAST with Jupiter copper caps.

I have not used them in a phono stage, but have had SOTA results in my tube amps and CD player. They are more even handed top to bottom, have more air and improved micro details. I also find them a tad smoother in the upper mids.

Both would be a big improvement if your amp has a Solen cap or something of like quality.

I know builders now using Jupiter instead of Duelund based on SQ only.
bigkidz
3,392 posts
 
Everything has limitations. I am working on building x-overs without caps now. Removing caps in the preamp to me has produced the best sound I have ever heard. In my comparisons, the caps get saturated compared to the transformers causing the sound to become (for lack of better description) hard sounds and bright. I don't think that a cap can react fast enough compared to the transformer so they sound a little stressed in direct comparison in my preamp design andother preamps that I modify. I also wind my own transformers because I could not find any company that made them for my design that were not without limitations, even a few custom designed ones. I have spend over three years testing and building transformers to get to where I am happy today. So far, I don't hear the limitations as much as any cap I have tried in the preamp and I have a box full of them. I also tried the Jupiter caps but I still prefer the V-Cap coppers to the Jupiter caps. The V-Caps are much more open, dynamic with more resolution. The Jupiter were a little warmer in the mids but lack the other attributes of the V-caps IMO. So far I have not come up with a design to remove the caps in the amp as mentioned above. But I am working on a hybrid power amp that will also use DHT tubes in the front end, all point-to-point wiring like the preamp I build. Anyone in the NYC area is welcome to come hear what I build or I may consider shipping a prototype one out.

Is there any truth to the rumor that the Jupiter cap having issues with heat from amps (wax melted)? Someone mentioned that they read something about this but I have not taken the time to investigate. I could be way off base here.
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,511 posts
 
The older, less expensive Jupiter caps had that problem Pete. Not the new ones. I think you heard the old ones, not the brand new copper foil ones. The new ones spank the Vcaps all day long.

Jupiter makes HT flat stacked and HT round which replaced the old leaky caps you speak of. These were and are aluminum caps......not the brand new copper foil.
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