Tube Preamps under $10k with deep bass extension

Aren't we talking first about small signal tubes that can get down to 20 Hz. When you have found the 'perfect' tubes I'm sure that there are a number of good tube pre-amps that can take advantage of this. A question crosses my mind...why would you be interedted in a tube pre that can pash out a 20 Hz fundamental?

Geoff

Marakanetz:

Sorry for being a heretic but build quality, while nice to have in those $10K products, is overrated, IMO. If it is cheap, sounds good and therefore doesn't need upgrading, and lasts, what's the problem? (:->). (Gotta work on my smiley faces!)

Don't get me wrong. I like the fit and finish of those expensive products and am not immune to it. I own a few that some might consider "overbuilt" but build quality, I find, is a term which is used a lot but is very hard to define. Sometimes it refers to weight, sometimes electronic parts, fancy wiring, shiny faceplates, fit and finish of cases and cabinetry, etc. The premium in the price for what we perceive as build quality is just enormous. Since we are all here for the sound rather than indefinable things or things which are not proven to correlate with good sound, I try to give those things a low priority. It is just my philosophy. I don't mean to disparage anyone else's.

Even with that said, I don't consider the AI to be a crappy product with regard to build quality. I am not saying that it is the absolutely best-sounding pre out there, but it ain't bad, and for the money, it is a steal. If you put it next to something that you think is way better, compare the two and tell me what is missing. My answer would be not much. That is all that I am saying.

Cheers,

I agree completely with your comments about build quality. It is overrated. And if you are to believe the reviewers, just about everything is "built like a tank" with "fit 'n finish beyond reproach."

Today I heard the Mcintosh C2200 and all I can say is tubes and bass! The windows were shaking! I was shocked! I really think you should demo this one!

I have put my AI M3A (w NOS Tungsram ECC88s) up against a conrad johnson LS16 and a very early version of the First Sound starter model, Presence (not Presence Deluxe or 4.0).
I preferred the M3A.
The cj is more than three time the M3A's price and the M3A has a phono section! Both the FS and cj did some things technically better, but the M3A simply allows more muscial life and drama to breathe. The cj was down-right boring--in two different systems. I have every confidence that a recent FS Presence Deluxe would sound very fine indeed.

The CAT Ultimate in my system is quick and has bass to die for. All four of these pre-amps have good bass. (I can get close to a 20Hz tone.) I would be surprised if anyone craving bass did not get all that a tubed pre-amp could offer in the way of bass from a CAT. (The CAT does not electrically mate with my pwr amps [Cary SLAM-100's] or I would probably be running with the CAT.)

I will receive a broken in Lamm LL2 in one week. If anyone is interested in the LL2 results, let me know. Supposed to have great bass....