Organ CDs with really deep bass

1. I'd like to thank those who have responded, especially Rcprince for his informed, knowledgeable responses, on the basis of which I am ordering the Felix Hell Reference Recordings CD and the David Higgs Delos CD of his recital on the Dallas Meyerson organ. This is just the kind of information I'd hoped to elicit, and I appreciate it.

2. There are very few organs in the world (I don't know how many) that have a 64-foot pipe. The gigantic Willis organ (146 stops, almost 11,000 pipes) in the Royal Albert Hall in London is one of them, and I believe there are one or two or three more. If I am correct this pipe would have a fundamental tone of 8 Hz, which would be less a musical "tone" than a minor seismic event, an almost countable pulse in the air. I doubt there has ever been an attempt to record this tone, and if it could be recorded I suppose nobody could play it back. But just as a sort of extra-musical curiosity, does anyone know anything about this esoteric subject?

3. Curiously enough, as Rcprince was writing and sending his second response, I was listening to the Dorian CD of Guillou and the Dallas SO playing the Jongen Symphonie Concertante and the Saint-Saens Organ Symphony, using the then-new Fisk organ in the Meyerson Center. You are quite right to point out the deep bass in the Jongen--a delightful performance and a very successful recording. To my ears the Saint-Saens is considerably less so; I don't like the balances here, with the organ too recessed and almost buried in the orchestral fabric. I realize that this was a conscious decision of the recording engineers, as explained in the notes, but I think it was a misjudgment and prevents this recording from being a candidate for one of the best performances of the Saint-Saens. I find not just the balances but the overall sound, including that of the orchestra, superior in the Jongen. You are quite right that the differences in the two are very clearly audible.

4. You might be interested to know that I live in Plano, TX, a suburb of Dallas, and am a season ticketholder of the Dallas SO, and have heard this organ in the Meyerson several times in concerts there. The DSO's resident organist Mary Preston gives monthly demonstrations on it (I'm attending the one in December). I've heard her perform the Saint-Saens with the DSO there and the results were very impressive--and somewhat comical in a way that I'm sure was not intended. The Meyerson has seating for a sizable chorus behind the orchestra and directly (and I do mean directly) in front of the organ, and these seats are sold to concertgoers when there is no chorus present. I was surprised to find these seats occupied by concertgoers for the Saint-Saens, and I wondered how many of them knew what they were going to be in for. I suspect most of them didn't, to judge from the outcome, because when the organ came barreling in full-bore in its stunning entry at the beginning of the Maestoso last movement, I saw many of them levitate a few inches out of their seats in shock; what they were hearing must have been deafening! I'm glad I wasn't sitting there.

5. It's disappointing to learn that the Ruffati organ in the Davies Hall doesn't use real 32-foot pipes but an electronic tone generator. No doubt it works, but somehow it seems like cheating. Thanks for this information, though, and I don't think I'd have known if you hadn't told me. I'll have to try to hear the Guillou/DeWaart Philips recording of the Saint-Saens (although I have so many versions of this piece already that I've no business acquiring any more).

6. I love the bit about being accompanied by the sound of Widor spinning in his grave! Yes, I know Guillou's reputation as a somewhat wayward free spirit (he is also a composer and a great improviser) and not the organist anyone would go to for "correct" or "scholarly" interpretations. Nevertheless I think his Dorian CDs are absolutely delightful; I have them all and take great pleasure in them, and they are magnificently recorded. Of course he is titulaire at St. Eustache in Paris, and that is a grand and mighty and impressive organ, but I like even better the recordings he has made on the Kleuker-Steinmeyer organ of the Tonhalle, Zurich, and the (rather small) Kleuker organ of Notre-Dame des Neiges, Alpe d'Huez, France; these are so colorful as played by Guillou and are recorded by Dorian with wonderful clarity and focus. (Guillou had significant input into the design of all three of these organs.)

7. I understand what you are saying about Murray and can see why some might find his playing a bit stodgy. But I find him an eminently satisfying organist, sound and musicianly, and I especially like his Bach. His playing is never flashy or trendy and he never seems to be trying to show off. One of his best Telarc CDs is The Young Bach, played on the lovely Gabriel Kney organ at the College of St. Thomas, St. Paul Minnesota. This is a rather small organ recorded with wonderful clarity and vividness by Telarc, and I think this CD is a triumph for all concerned.

8. Other favorite organists of mine are Herrick, Alain, and Hurford, and I still love a number of the old Biggs recordings. Fox I have never much cared for; there is often something garish and vulgar about his playing to my ears. But I know many organ buffs admire him.

9. I'd love to hear from any other organ buffs who'd like to recommend favorite organ recordings with first-rate sound. Thanks again.

As far as 64 foot stops go, there are some organs that have them; I think the Washington Cathedral may have one, and perhaps the Wannamaker Organ in Philadelphia. There's supposedly a 64 foot stop and 8hz note used on the M&K Power and Glory LP, although that may be a resultant from two 32 foot stops; my system doen't go low enough to hear it, although I remember some queaziness in my stomach listening to it, so there may be some truth to the rumor.

On the use of an electronic 32 foot stop, we use a tone generator for the 32 foot stop of our small organ in my church. When we got the thing (it's really a large speaker, which you amplify with an amp with a level control), I put it on a wheelbarrow and wheeled it around the church working with our organist to find the spot it would best integrate with the rest of the organ. We wound up putting it above and behind the choir loft, adjacent to the church offices and a large meeting room. When our organist, who loves deep bass, set the amplifier to figure the proper level, he initially didn't realize how sensitive the driver was, and when he played the first 16hz low C he knocked all the pictures off the walls in the meeting room and offices and drove the church staff out of the building fearing that an earthquake had occurred (any of you had that problem integrating a subwoofer?)! It may be cheating, Texasdave, but it actually does work quite well, and is a nice alternative for an organ that doesn't have the space in its chambers for a true 32 foot pipe.

When I do want to shake my house I use Telarc SACD 60579 "The Sound of Glory" Morman Tabernacle Chior. This is not exclusively organ music, but they do have one monster organ there in Salt Lake City, and most of the stops were pulled out on some of the selections. This is a Hybrid disc, so it will work on a regular CD player, although I have never used it that way.

Eldartford, thanks for the tip about the Telarc Mormon Tabernacle CD. I'll check it out.

Thanks for the additional information, Rcprince. I regularly attended organ concerts in the National Cathedral outside Washington DC back in 1963-64. I was quite impressed by this mighty organ (in fact it was the experience of hearing concerts played on this organ that got me hooked on organs and organ music), and if I remember correctly I got a specification of it at the time; I believe it's an Aeolian-Skinner organ, and I'm pretty sure it does not have a 64-foot pipe. Like you I would have guessed that the huge Wanamaker organ in Philadelphia would be a likely candidate to have such a pipe. I seem to remember years ago encountering a reference to some continental European organ(s) with such a pipe. Anyone know more about this?

I love your story about the pictures coming off the walls and the staff exiting the building when the 16 Hz tone was generated at your church! This rig really sounds like a kind of super subwoofer and amp, basically pretty much like what we audiophiles use, although no doubt larger and more powerful--would that be correct? Speaking of knocking the pictures off the walls, I haven't had that happen, but when I play the bass warble tones on any of the three Stereophile Test CDs (very useful, I've found, in finding the optimum positions for speakers and subwoofers and setting levels), I've noticed that when I get down to the 25 Hz and 20 Hz warble tones, I start to get a significant (clearly audible) amount of rattling, shaking, and buzzing of various objects in the room. To a lesser extent I also occasionally get this with some pipe organ recordings (had it happen just yesterday, in fact, with Christopher Herrick's Organ Fireworks volume 9 on Hyperion, a CD that could certainly be added to the list of recommendable, well-recorded organ CDs with really deep bass).

Some that I've found to be quite revealing:

JS Bach:
Toccatas, Fugues, Fantasia, etc. (Works for Organ, vol. 4)
Kevin Bowyer (organ)
Nimbus (1993)

Chorale Preludes, Preludes, Fugues, etc. (Works for Organ, vol. 8)
Kevin Bowyer (organ)
Nimbus (1996)

Toccatas and Fugues, BWV 538, 540, 564, 565; Passacaglia in C min., BWV 582
Christopher Herrick (organ)
Hyperion (1990)

Trio Sonatas 1-6, BWV 525-530
David Sanger (organ)
Meridian (1991)

Orlando Gibbons:
Keyboard Music ("The Woods So Wild")
John Toll (harpsichord and organ)
Linn (2002)