What will you be playing to celebrate?

Ya know, this is what really bugs me about everything.

You can go to any country in the world and live there and make plenty of friends. Any country. They might be your friends but they will still hate your country.

It boils down to this, there are upwards of 6 billion people on the planet, and the wars that kill millions are because of the actions of probably far less than 1 million.

Every country has its dark period, every country becomes a monster at one point. No country is immune.Even the high and mighty USA, took a dark step when they nuked japan.

I was in the military, and i knew there was a possibility that i would have to kill for my country, and sometimes i wondered about that, about how different i am from my enemys. Im just some joe, joined the service to to get hot meals and a warm bed. How much different is my enemy?
My enemy probably joined for the same reason. We are pawns who pay the ultimate sacrifice because world leaders cannot get along.
Instead of me killing him, and him killing me, what would happen if we had talked without somone we know of but never met stating we are enemys?
We would probably get along. Probably become friends.

It is very easy to assume that a county is the sum of its leaders. Unfortunatly, that is not usually the case.

Too bad the young have to die when the old start the wars.

I think the children of politicians should join the military. Maybe they wouldnt be so hesitant to start wars.

Im still glad we got that sonofabitch saddam. He had to go.

Slappy is certainly on to something here.

Gunbei,

You certainly have a very, very good understanding of history. I've enjoyed your posts to this thread a lot. You've put considerable effort into your posts and have enlightened many readers that obviously are emotional on these subjects rather than intellectual.

My father barely survived the Bataan death march. He didn't speak of his experiences until shortly before his death of cancer in 1995 and only then because I begged him. I had been told by one of his fellow Marines of his attempt to save his closest, wounded friend by physically assisting him. The Japanese soldiers that forced this march were furious that Dad and his wounded friend could keep up the pace and made a cruel game out of slowly making them fail. Dad received several minor bayonet wounds that ultimately slowed them down. At a point when his friend slipped from his grasp he turned, locked eyes and watched as a bayonet was shoved through his friends throat. Even after this experience Dad never spoke harshly of the Japanese as a people.

It has been estimated that 500,000 US soldiers lives were saved by the two bombs dropped on Japan. In Harry Truman's own words that is why he decided to use nuclear weapons. Saving face lost its significance once the bombs were dropped. So, now we know that saving face is determined by its cost of doing so. Since there is no such threat today Japanese society doesn't feel compelled to lose face by admitting and apologizing for the slave comfort girls from Korea and China. Pride is keeping hatred throughout the Orient on a low burn.

I've had the pleasure of working intimately with several Japanese engineers on an egg breaker joint project in the mid 80's. (Before you make fun of an egg breaker, understand that it separates the yolk and egg whites to the tune of 36,000 eggs per hour with one operator. We're not talking about throwing eggs here.) I enjoyed their company immensely and we became good friends, or as good of friends as we could during the three months we were together. One of the engineers was a survivor of Nagasaki. On an evening when I arranged a huge Japanese meal, figuring they were growing tired of American food, this fellow spoke of WWII. All of his subordinates were solemn while he spoke as was I. He wanted me to know that he felt the Americans did what they had to do and he had no hard feelings at all. This was a totally unsolicited commentary.

Slappy is right. If only the likes of that elderly engineer and my father could have a meaningful voice in world affairs we would live in a better place. Unfortunately it's a rare occurance when a real human being rises to leadership.

Most conflict on the world stage arises by design. Even knowing history from every textbook angle one must be Sherlock Holmes to see the real criminals. The money brokers control the unfolding of events and the outcome. Their roles are left out of the textbooks because too few even know who they are. War is a huge smokescreen that keeps them hidden from view. Once war is over they scoop up property and industry when governments are destroyed and religious institutions are weakened.

Slappy is right that problems are created by a small percentage of the worlds population but it is far less than a million. More like a handful.

Great Posts!

"Politics is the allocation of resources"

This is the oldest definition, and now especially that Saddam is no longer to be feared, everyone in Iraq will be posturing for the best leverage. Those who have an interest in the Americans staying will continue to pretend they are in command. The ones who are most adept at getting their way will and, quite frankly, for all of our good intentions, money and military, we will be irrelevant.

We do still get the oil, but then we never didn't have it. George W. Bush got Saddam. Everyone wins.

Except the dead and their families.

I was afraid that I may have gotten too overzealous with my initial comments in this thread. It's great to hear such wise words from you guys.

One thing that still erks me to this day is the policy of silence the Japanese government uses when confronted with dark areas in their history such as WWII crimes. My Dad receives a daily Japanese language newspaper, and in the english section I occasionally see articles about the "comfort women", women from China and Korea who were abducted and made to serve Japanese soldiers as sex slaves. The Germans have repeatedly apologized and made massive reparations to Jewish families and Israel for Hitler's crimes. I was raised in a "Japanese Way" to be honorable and face up to my mistakes, so when I see modern Japan sixty years since WWII unable to issue any kind of apology for so many of the wrongs committed then it makes my blood boil and I feel ashamed.

You folks are so right about separating the everyday people from the few in power who make the decision to go to war. Case in point.

My father was shot down twice during the war, so I'm quite fortunate to exist and be able to post in the Audiogon forums! A few years after my father moved to the US he was contacted by a man saying he had some how located my father through the War Department and he in fact was one of the guys that shot my Dad down. My Dad flew reconnaissence missions for the Japanese Navy in areas such as the Aleutian Islands in the north Pacific and Rabaul in the south. On one of these missions he was shot down and survived two days floating in the middle of ocean with his wounded navigator until a Japanese sub located them. My Dad often jokes that if he didn't have photos and information the Navy wanted they might have left him bobbing up and down like cork.

The fellow who contacted my Dad was a lawyer from New York who happened to be in Los Angeles and was wondering if my Dad would like to meet for dinner. I don't know if I was born at the time but my Mom went along and they had a very nice time. My father said this man from New York was apologetic, but my father really had no ill feelings. As with some of the other WWII my dad met they all agreed that they were only doing their job for their country and there was no personal animosity at all.

I realize the way one feels about their war experience largely depends on how traumatic it was, so I find it interesting that Vietnam veterans seem to harbor much more resentment. It could have to do with the way the two wars were viewed and treated by the public at the time.

I can remember being a young kid at my parent's dinner parties and having some WWII vets there. Most were my dad's friends from his architectual firm and had served the US military in the south pacific and Europe. However, my favorite "uncle" was a guy named Ted who served under General Rommell in the tank brigade in north Africa. This was one funny and fun guy to be around! Can you imagine a German soldier, a couple US army guys and a Japanese pilot having a family get together? Pretty neat stuff.

Lugnut, I often forget your theory of how money runs the world and I'm jolted back into focus when I see preferential treatment given to firms like Haliburton. The way the bidding was conducted and post war rebuilding planned, it makes you think the whole purpose for chasing Saddam into a hole was just so we could rebuild the damn country. It doesn't seem to make sense since it cost so much to conduct the war in the first place.