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Blind Listening Tests?

I would like help locating any articles or studies on the subject of blind listening tests as it relates to high end audio equipment. I realize this is akin to blasphemy for many who are into this hobby, however, the more times I read of people claiming to hear audible differences between certain components and system set-ups, the more skeptical I become.(e.g. equipment racks ,interconnects,etc.)The fact that virtually every major audio publication is so adamently against the idea only adds to my skepticism.

Before I invoke the wrath of this site's faithful, let me clarify that I am not doubting the sincerity of those who claim to hear sonic differences between certain components. However, believing that an audible difference exists when one knows that he is listening to a piece of equipment that is generally well regarded or made by a well respected manufacturer is entirely different from being able to detect the difference in a blind listening scenario. Given the undisputed connection between the mind and our perceptions, why is there so much sentiment against such tests? Couldn't the results of such testing be simply another piece of information that we could factor in to our purchasing decisions. It seems to me that those who are so sure of ther critical listening ability (i.e. all stereophile reviewers) should not hesitate to prove their skills.

I look forward to any help in directing me to more information on the subject.Thanks, Don.
dtittle
garfish
1,840 posts
 
Dtittle; I think in my first response I spelled your name wrong-- sorry, and I looked closer this time. Thanks for your response-- the equipment you have certainly indicates that you are "one of us". I mentioned critical listening skills-- well, they could be very effectively used in blind testing as well as sighted. Avguy, JD you guys crack me up (and I voted accordingly), and I hope humor is never disallowed on Agon. Actually, I flunked my last test Avguy-- too much sugar:>) It's nice to have a polite exchange on this contentious subject. Cheers. Craig.
danvetc
527 posts
 
As a medical man, and a proponent of "evidence based medicine," (which means therapeutic decisions should be based on clear evidence of efficacy vs. fads or favorites,) I think there is a very real place for double blind testing anytime one wants to make definitive statements on performance. None of us are immune to the esthetics of our components, (unless we are blind,) nor are we unswayed by favorite companies whose founders, representatives, or dealers we are fond of. As I read the original post, the question was to blind testing as a part of the review process, which I believe to be legitimate. I would love to watch the hotshots at the mags in a double blind test. I think we might be very surprised at the outcomes. That does not mean that any of us should enjoy a piece less if it does not stand to blind testing critique. I, for one, just like the way some things look on the rack and it adds greatly to my enjoyment and the whole experience of music, so I will keep them untilÂ…

Charlie
Ag insider logo xs@2x
drubin
3,275 posts
 
Very well said, Charlie.
philiphansg71e6
2 posts
 
Hi Don, I think your original thread is a very complex question to start with.
Audio Engineering Society 2000 November journal published an excellent paper written by Seymour Shlien, "Auditory Models for Gifted Listeners". The author introduced the subject about certain professions like musician, piano tuner, recording/mastering engineers whose job depend on their better than average hearing ability. What's significant to this Audiogon thread is that his test results on 14 subjects identified some outstanding listeners in having (if I may quote) ".. unusual ability to hear signals or discriminate small differences. This skill show itself among audiophiles or musicians who may be willing to spend significant resources in order to achieve the best audio reproduction quality. Though these listeners are hard to please, they are an important component of the audio consumer market, and some effort should be made to understand the reason for their special needs." The paper has real tables & charts, very scientific...
As an audiophile and AES member myself, after reading this paper i felt reassured and understand my hearing capabilty and needs better now. Don, you should also try to get hold of this AES issue. Regards Phil
70242241e18c
81 posts
 
Jostler3, the ABX page is no longer on the URL you cited. It's here: http://www.oakland.edu/~djcarlst/abx.htm

It's got very good documentation of the double-blind test process and explanations of the statistical analysis involved in evaluating the results.

Also, in a white paper by Dr. Floyd Toole there's a description of tests where the listeners were allowed to see the speakers they were evaluating and tests where they were not; not surprisingly, in the "non-blind" tests they gave higher marks to the speaker systems that looked more attractive. The white paper is at http://www.harman.com/wp/pdf/AudioScience.pdf.

I like double blind tests. It's fun to take them and to witness others taking them. Especially when there's an "everybody knows a Goldbrick M9000 sounds better than a Conethumper Gizmotron" type of comparison being made. Well, after the test, maybe everybody doesn't know that now. Or maybe a listener will hear audible differences between A and B and find that the one that sounds better actually isn't the one they assumed was superior.

I believe in getting value for what I spend on audio gear. If something commands a premium price, it ought to offer comparable audible benefits. And I stress again, audible. If not, keep it, because I'm not interested in impressing people with how much I can spend. I just want great sound.
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