Best Integrated Amp? Help...

If separates are a possible track, that would be a whole different ball of wax. Shooting for decent sound, control and power in excess of 100W in a pair of even used separates for under 2 grand is a tall order.

The product that immediately comes to my mind would be a used Odyssey Stratos amplifier with the Cap upgrade for power and possibly an Odyessy Candela tube preamp. This combination could be had for under two grand. It is only 150W but it has tremendous current capacity - which I think is more important for control and dynamics.

Another idea could be finding a Rotel RB 1080 (200W/ch) and RC 1080 preamp used.

Not sure either of these pairings would perform considerably better or even as well as some of the really very good integrated amps recommended above - and they would take up more space.

In general, good luck with this.

I'm thinking that separates only make sense if the OP has a pre or an integrated that can serve as the pre. Then a used stereo amp might be possible.

The fact that he says Rowland didn't work with these tells me he needs more power, plus knowing B&W to a degree. Of course Rowland would have never been in price point, unless it was pretty old.

Dave

Good point about possibility of using existing integrated or pre and loading up downstream with watts and current in a separate box. JI2 originally asked for info about a new integrated - which led me to think they have need/want for both control and power amp in the same box.

This brings up the question of relative importance of power and pre amps to the sound that would eventually emerge from 804's. Perhaps the Rowland had the juice, but not the finesse? Or some kind of impedance matching difficulty? Not trying to argue a point here as much as throw an idea out there for folks to react to. I guess I think both control and power are important to overall sound, but am starting to think Preamp is critical link...

JI2, if you can get a Blue Circle NSCS for under $2K I think you may want to try that and flip it if it doesn't work out - doubt you would lose much in the transaction.

Knownothing, you really like the Blue Circle NSCS. You have been plugging one for a while, are you selling one?
It is pushing the price point for me.
I had a Classe CAP-80 that ran my B&Ws better than the Jeff Rowland Concentra II. I do not think it is a issue of power because the Classe had 80W to the Rowland's 150W. I went to the CAP-151, and then Classe separates. Worked the B&Ws right, until I met BAT. The Rowland just sounded like it was on mute, even at high volume. I do not understand why...
I came off of BAT separates, beautiful pieces. I would opt for the BAT-VK300 integrated, but that is too much $, and I do not have $ to spare right now.
I also need space, so 1 piece is better than 2.
I like the magnum dynalab 308 integrated.
I demoed the Krell KAV300, and did not like the sound [a little dark and cold].
I am worried the 400 would be the same.
Thank you all for your imput.

I would think that the Rowland Concerto would have been fine with the 804 since it's got 250 watts, but maybe he had an older unit. There would be no lack of finesse in the Concerto, but if you got much lower power with those speakers I think that bass would be poorly controlled and the transparency in thickly scored pieces would be obscured.

As I moved up the power chain with my Vienna Acoustic Beethoven Baby Grands, each step was pretty dramatic. I started with a 50 wpc Bryston which was fine until pushed or with really deep bass content. Next I went to the Conrad Johnson CA200 for 175 wpc into 8 ohms, which really showed me what the bass good do and got much cleaner on complex passages, particularly at high volume. When I went to the Rowland Continuum 500 the bass control grew by an order of excellence and the transparency opened up further, dramatically. The pres all were incremental improvements in each case, but I think it was the amplifier section that really took over my speakers and made them way more dynamic and focused. The B&W has a similar need for power and control, IME.

Given the budget, 200 watts is the minimum that I'd go for, but hope for a way to get closer to 500 watts.

Dave