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World's best Pre-amp for $10K and above?

Looking for the HOLY GRAIL in Audio? Here it is. I'm in my early sixties and retiring to my final system, which I was going to purchase during the past twelve months and decided to put on the brakes, and investigate whats out there as the most advanced engineered high end audio products for the money in the market place. As far as I'm concerned, the two top engineers in the world for the best Amp and Preamp at low prices are Bent Holter with Hegel Audio in Norway and Roger Sanders with Sanders Sound in Colorado. Why? The Hegel P-30 Pre-amp is a game changer, and will easily compete with Pre-amps at $30K and above. The FM Acoustics 268 Preamp that retails for $107K, uses a technology thats called "feedforward" instead of feedback.
Amps and Pre-amps since the early 80's have all used either global feedback, zero feedback or local feedback to filter out noise and lower distortion by sending and filtering the feedback current to filter capacitors or or an extra filter transformer. A small amount of voltage feedback occurs at the output stage in amps and preamps which goes back into the parts and boards causing noise and distortion which smears the quality of the music.The best Preamps in the world all have S/N noise ratios at 125 db's or above. The Hegel P-30 Preamp uses the same feedforward technology as FM Acoustics but is a more current design that Bent Holter calls "Sound Engine" patented technology that eliminates feedback which is why the P-30 Preamp has a S/N ratio of 132 db's, which has never been accomplished in high end audio with a Preamp costing $10K or below. The same applies to Roger Sanders Magtech amplifier which uses a patented linear voltage regulator that controls and regulates voltage with no excess voltage going back into the amp causing heat and distortion problems. The amp puts out 900 watts into 4ohms. Krell makes a pair of mono blocs that also use a similar voltage regulator. The amps are $100K a pair. HERES THE PERFECT SOLID STATE SYSTEM. A Hegel P-30 Preamp. A Sanders Magtech amp, A pair of Aerial Acoustics 7T speakers. The worlds finest SACD player, the Playback Designs MPS-5, designed by Andreas Koch, who invented SACD technology when he worked for Sony. He built the worlds first outboard DAC in 1982 and is legend in digital engineering. The MPS-5 is the most analog sounding player on the market which costs $17K. The Hegel P-30 is only $7500.00 and the Magtech amp is only $5K. The Aerials are $10K. Buy the solid core cables from Morrow Audio. They are low capacitance cables which matches up perfectly with these components. This combination sounds like the very best tube and solid state gear on the market. The whole system will cost about $42K but will sound as good as any system costing $200K. All of these products are game changers. If you want better looking cabinets and faceplates, then blow your money, but you will not get better performance for what this system has to offer. It is the HOLY GRAIL you are searching for and there is no better combination for the total cost of the system.
audiozen
charles1dad's avatar
charles1dad
10,250 posts
 
Grannyring,
Many would agree with you.In my former Quicksilver preamp I relaced the standard MIT capacitors with V-cap and SoniPlatinum(coupling caps). The improvement was profound! There`s no other way to describe the change.There are examples of very exspensive audio components that use run of the mill average parts,crossovers(in high price speakers) are notorious for skimping with cheaper parts.
jwm
918 posts
 
Grannyring no one is saying that parts don't make a difference. Atmasphere said a well designed circuit is more important than just the parts alone. This thread is not talking about parts, but about amplifier specs. in deciding whether you want to own the component. Changing to the Dueland is not going to change what you can measure unless the part your replacing is plus or minus 20%; in other wards way out of spec.
clio09
3,360 posts
 
You can tailor the sound through the topology.
I think my point is you start with the circuit, and the specs which should provide 99% of the sound of the unit.

This is what I gleaned from Ralph's posts above. Good quality and reliable parts, and not necessarily expensive parts, is a must, but its all in the circuit.

I don't know Frank Van Alstine and have never heard his equipment. I do know he has a fine reputation and is respected among his peers, which says a lot. I think he's probably earned the right to have a strong opinion on the subject at of boutique parts and wire.

I do know Roger and I have his equipment, one unit modified by the previous owner, and another stock. I can say I learned more about audio in one session with Roger than I did in several years (and a few wasted dollars) previously. Same for conversations with others like Ralph.

So people can listen to parts and wire and whatever else they enjoy listening to, hopefully music will be included in the equation. IMO, based on what I have learned, the enjoyment still starts and is largely responsible through a well designed circuit.
atmasphere's avatar
atmasphere
11,861 posts
 
Charles1dad, I tried real hard but I could never get those MIT caps to sound right to me, if I used them as a coupling cap. If I am not mistaken though, the MIT uses several caps in parallel in a single package. I have found that to be a bad move in a coupling cap (although it can be just fine as a bypass in a power supply)- whenever there is a bypass in a coupling cap, smearing occurs, and causes troubles in the high frequencies.

So I figure you use one cap and give it your best shot. The problem is that in tube preamps, you often have to have a very large cap at the output, and even if its the best Teflon or paper and oil, its still going to have an adverse effect due to the size required. So I came up with a direct-coupled circuit, basically side-stepping that problem.

Another, rather surprising way to get around that problem is to go with an electrolytic! I know, I know, most audiophiles think electrolytics are terrible and they have good reason to think so. The problem is an electrolytic will not function correctly unless it is polarized with a voltage. In a tube preamp this is easy (you should try it!), but in a lot of solid state designs the designer neglects to polarize the caps and so they introduce distortion when the waveform charges the cap in the wrong direction! **That** is where electrolytics got their bad reputation.

If I have not made the point clearly in this post, the bottom line is that as a designer you have to watch what you are doing with caps. The MIT above is a great example- a good cap, but don't use it for coupling. Same thing with electrolytics, but make sure that the DC across them is always more than the total AC waveform they will pass if you do that they will easily give good quality film caps a run for the money!). See what I mean?
grannyring's avatar
grannyring
6,510 posts
 
Amen Clio09.

Jwm - Yes, I am going beyond the thread. I assume this is ok at times:-)
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