Forward sounding speakers that Rock


I sold my Revel Salons1 recently due to space issues after a house move. I really liked the speakers a lot and was sad to sell them. I had them for 5 years in a perfectly proportioned room. I t has been 1 year now since I moved and I have changed from the Salons (170 lbs) to the Audioengine2 (5 lbs). Such is life :).

I listen to lots of genres of music but Rock is my mainstay. I use Rush's Moving Pictures CD as my reference to see if a speaker can get to me emotionally. One deficiency with the Salons, for me, was the feeling that it was a little laid back for Rock music, but it was over the top brilliant for others (Reggae, Folk, Jazz). At that time I was willing to live with it.

I am also extremely happy with the audio gear that I have. My goal was to create a clean clear neutral chain of audio gear. I think I have accomplished this to my satisfaction and I will not pull any hair over any minor deficiencies. My audio chain is as follows:

Bryston 7B-SST monoblock amps (with filter choke upgrade) | BAT VK-42SE Solid State Pre-amp | Sony SCD-1 SACD player with VSEI Level 5+ mod |Au24 balanced interconnects from pre to amps | AudioQuest Volcano speaker wire| Virtual Dynamics power chords and interconnect from SACD to pre

It looks like there could be a return to audio bliss again in 12-18 month timeframe (move to a house) so I started investigating some new speakers. First I went and heard the Usher Tiny Dancer and was sold on its sound from such a small package. It was also laid back and may not be the best Rock speakers but I felt it was a very high quality speaker. I may buy these to tie me over until move into a house with more space.

Next stop was a store in Santa Barbara, CA that only carried B&W gear (I was initially disappointed at that prospect). I went through the lineup and stopped at the 802D floor standing. I cued by my standard CD and was really emotionally moved by the sounds. It was forward, clean and got my energy levels pumped up. This was the way I want to listen to Rock. The speaker was smaller than the Salon1 and it likely won’t have the same level of bass, but the forward presentation was really very attractive to me. It was also in a smaller package so that was a huge benefit. The gear used was all Classe and we used an integrated Amp that was underpowered to really bring out all the best qualities of those speakers.

After I left I walked across the street and went to a Revel shop. I wanted to hear the Sudio2. It was setup with all Mark Levinson gear with enough power. I cued up the same music (3 CD’s) and I heard the same sound I had at my old house. It had a little more detail but the presentation was laid back. I was surprised how much more I liked the B&W over the Revels for Rock. So I decided no more Revels in my future. The B&W 802D is the current top contender for my dream house.

So I wanted to ask fellow A’Gon members their opinions on what they would consider a competitor to the B&W 802D. I would be willing to have a bit of top end coloration since I think I have a clean audio chain. I want that forward (non-laid back) sound that I now think works best for Rock. My price range is 12-14K for new speakers. I would also like to keep the height less than 4 feet due to potential WAF.

Thanks for reading this long post.
yyz
Greetings YYZ,

I've noticed exactly what you're talking about with Rush recordings - many otherwise fine-sounding systems sound lifeless with Rush. I don't think the entire answer is necessarily a forward tonal balance; rather, I think it has as much if not more to do with conveying the dynamic inflection of the musicians.

Rush uses dynamic nuance to convey rhythm more than most rock bands, and if the system doesn't get the dynamics right Rush will let you know. One of my test songs is Dreamline off of Roll the Bones, which sounds awful if the dynamic shadings are opaqued but magnificent when it all comes together. Then once the system is working well, I'll put on Camera Eye and turn out the lights and leave the world behind for eleven minutes or so.

Now the primary enemy of dynamic contrast is thermal compression. That's where the voice coil heats up (virtually instantaneously) from a music peak, which causes its resistance to rise. When the resistance rises, not only does it now take more power to overcome that resistance but most amplifiers will actually put out less power into a higher resistance load. In my opinion the answer is high quality prosound drivers (which have negligible thermal compression at normal in-home loudness levels) ideally combined with an amplifier that does not deliver reduced wattage into a higher impedance load (such as an SET or OTL tube amp).

Duke
cast in this unlikely role
dealer/manufacturer
The 802D is designed with a hump in the bass and a scooped midrange. It is a
great choice for rock. Rush moving pictures is one of their best. Originally
mastered on ATC's by Bob Ludwig at Masterdisk in NY (if you are like me then
you have an old Vinyl version with "RL Masterdisk" written on it). The 1997
CD version was remastered again by Bob Ludwig at his own Gateway Studios in
Maine, again on ATC. If you want a more forward sound than B&W then try ATC
but if you liked the B&W's I don't think you will like the more forward ATC sound
and missing bass hump. Bob uses Eggleston's now so you might want to check
them out (they have lots of good quality bass too - good for rock). If you like
loud rock with dynamics and clean sound then ATC is definitely worth adding to
your short list.
Yyz,

I had the Revels and had to sell them to. I have owned the Eggleston Andra's that were not to tall but was very disappointed in the bass. I have also owned the Thiel CS 7,CS6,2.3 and the 1.6. I also have listened to the 3.6 alot and it will really put out some great sound and alot of DB's if you have the power. I.M.H.O. and some speakers that I watch for are the Thiel MCS 1's. I A-B'd them against the Wilson Cubs and the Cubs broke up at LOUD volume while the MCS 1's just kept going. I used a Genesis R900 Sub, still one of the best I have ever heard. Some people may laugh but I always wonder why you dont see any MCS 1's for sale. No one will part with them and before its said and down I will have another set!!!!
Eggleston Savoy's for sale right now on gon in your price range, this is a unbelievable price for such a speaker. These would awesome, unfortunately they are a little bigger than you description. The build quality is amazing, pictures do not do them justice. I owned the Andra II's, one down from these and which are really nice speakers also but at this price it's a no brainer.
Moving Pictures on LP and my MFS CD works wonderful for demoing. Many early Rush CD masters where never mastered proper for CD sound is very hard bright but not on my Rush LPs and MFS CDs bass + drums are powerful. Trebles not hard at all. Loudspeakers for me that sound best on my Rush collection are mostly large horn systems. Maybe look into Audiokinesis loudspeakers Duke has a nicly designed compact horn I mean wave guide loudspeaker;) Or 12-14k would go far for a custom built or DIY loudspeaker easy to pass WAF let wife pick finish.