Marantz PM 17SA v PM 8003

Nothing could be further from the truth. Yes, its possible that the 2 amps may be very similar, but there's absolutely no reason why they can't sound completely different.

I believe that was exactly my point. I thought I was pretty clear meaning their power OUTPUT sections are almost identical so go with the amp that is better built as it is bound to sound better. As a Marantz Reference owner, thanks for reaffirming my point. Maybe I can do the same for you someday.

" I thought I was pretty clear meaning their power OUTPUT sections are almost identical so go with the amp that is better built as it is bound to sound better."

Your point is clear. It just doesn't make sense. If they're almost identical, then why would they sound different? Also, if they're almost identical, then why would the build quality be different?

Why not see if the seller is willing to bring the amp over so you can make a quick comparison assuming its for sale locally. This would take the speculation out of the equation. Hell give them a couple bucks for gas if need be. To sit here and guess which amp might be better based on specs or what country it was manufactured in seems rather senseless. You will only know from auditioning it for yourself. Even if someone were to chime in that has owned both may still not help you as we all hear things differently.

Your point is clear. It just doesn't make sense. If they're almost identical, then why would they sound different? Also, if they're almost identical, then why would the build quality be different?

Just because their power OUTPUT is almost identical, doesn't mean they can't sound very different because of build quality. Besides, in case you didn't know, these are integrated amps we are talking about. So there is a preamp section that has nothing to do with their power amp section. This can and often will radically change how an amp, given the same power OUTPUT, will sound.

Finally, these are also two different models - one made in Japan and the other made in China. That's why the build quality would be different. So, my point makes perfect sense.

So then you are talking about the performance of the amp by looking at the spec sheet. And now that you've clarified it, you're referring to power output only and not sound quality. That wasn't clear in your other posts. To be honest, though, I never trust specs on an amps power. In this particular case, since they are both SS amps made by the same company, at about the same time, then I guess its possible to get away with looking at the stated power output as accurate, in relation to each other. If you were to measure both amps the same way, they would probably be close enough to make the claim valid. But no guarantees.