Rock: well recorded bass...60s/70s

I'll take the "blame" for Bdp thinking someone said Cream was a prog band - though that's not what I said. Certainly, they were not one of the "art rock" bands (defining art rock as a sub-genre of Prog Rock) like I would consider ELP, Genesis, King Crimson or Yes to be. BUT if you read the discussion about musical characteristics of Prog found at the link here, to my ear and mind, many of these same elements are present in some (not all) of Cream's songs (e.g., We're Going Wrong, White Room, Tales of Brave Ulysses seem like good examples and I think there are others. Those are the ones that come to mind).
Prog Defined

From that same Prog Archives site, if you read what the authors are calling Hard Prog
(see link here: Hard Prog ), hard rock/heavy blues as played by Cream (and others) is cited as an influence on the Hard Prog sub-genre. If you look up the Wikipedia entry on Cream they cite Rush as a prog rock band influenced by Cream's live shows. When you read the Cream bio in the AllMusicGuide I see a strong overlap in that discussion of the prog music characteristics in the definition previously mentioned.

I'm not claiming the idea is original with me but independent of those sources, given Jack's and Ginger's jazz resume, Jack's classical training and Pete Brown's lyrics, and based on what I hear in some of their music, I think they were seminal to progressive rock; seminal as in "strongly influencing later developments".

Loomis - I was going to name Layla/D&TD (along with maybe, Journeyman) as an exception to falling out of love with Eric after Blind Faith. In the interest of the point I was trying to make, didn't seem worth it. I guess I'm kinda lukewarm on that album. Some of the song writing is pretty strong but the sound always seemed really crappy to me. And while some songs are very strong it doesn't have the energy or drive for me that Cream had. D&TD was a totally different place that EC wanted to be in. I don't hate it but if that was the only work of Clapton's that I knew - I don't think I'd be in love. Hey I have an open mind on it. Just saw Music Direct has a Japanese SHM SACD version of it. Maybe that'll be the ticket.

Enjoying the discussion. Apologies for my lengthy reply. I try to be complete.

Whart - Agree with you whole heartedly. The music categories get blurry and the boundaries leak (bleed into one another). 60s/70s were a fantastic period for music. I definitely appreciate the influence Britain has had on our "American" music.

Ghost- my recollection is, I went through several different copies of Layla before I found one that sounded pretty good and had energy. I had always considered it to be a terrible recording. I can take a look when I get a minute- it's probably an early Atco, but I don't remember the details. Worth revisiting, as is the Delanie & Bonnie album he did, which I bought new when it came out- and was completely turned off at the time- country? WTF? Now, with age, distance, different expectations, and a more broad ranging interest in all kinds of music, it's pretty good as well. I loved Cream, and eventually bought good pressings of many of their records. Blind Faith was another one that was a mixed bag- some great songs, and some filler, plus what I considered to be a wooly, muffled sounding record. The first UK pressings are decent, and not nutty money. I'm just glad I'm not collecting 78's!

Whart - I will happily take any advice you care to pass on. Good reminder about EC w/Delaney & Bonnie. I do buy vinyl but must say I'm not a serious collector...just not educated enough on what's original vs 2nd pressing etc. etc. I do prefer to buy older (even if not first pressing) as opposed to new, "audiophile"/re-mastered releases but it's a crap-shoot for me. I spend what I can afford and don't get too crazy on any single purchase. Some purchases sound better than others. I don't spend too much time fretting over my collection's resale value. Wasn't really thinking vinyl for Layla but tips on a good sounding version would be very nice. Thanks.

There is a really great clip on You Tube of Clapton talking about The Band and what he thought when he heard Music From Big Pink. That hearing resulted in Eric's disbanding (ha) Cream. It's funny, because when I finally got The Band (took about a year---I wasn't quite ready for them at the time of MFBP's release), I also lost interest in Cream and their ilk (long solos, lack of ensemble playing, mediocre songs, not much harmony singing). He went to Big Pink for a couple of weeks, waiting for them to ask him to join (?!), until finally realizing they didn't need him. No duh. "Badge" is the only Cream song I ever feel myself longing to hear.

Loomis, my questioning of Cream being considered Progressive was not in response to your post directly above mine (it hadn't "appeared" yet), but rather to Ghosthouse's above it.

I also don't consider Procol Harum Progressive, even with Matthew Fisher's Classical training. One great thing about a Group/Band being so good is that they create their own genre, of which they are the only member. They were, by the way, also really good live. The first three albums are great, but when Matthew left, guitarist Robin Trower kind of took over, turning them too bluesy for my liking. Having no blues influence was one of the things that had set PH apart from the other Brits of the late 60's/early 70's.

The MC5 never really took off on the West Coast for some reason (actually, they never took off anywhere!), but their influence was pretty big in the Punk Bands that followed them a few years later (The Ramones especially). I didn't take them seriously, thinking they were just the house band for the White Panther Party! Another Group that didn't translate to the counter-culture West was Iggy & The Stooges. I don't remember either of them playing in San Francisco or Los Angeles.

The Groovies really felt like fish out of water living in San Francisco (they had nothing in common with The Grateful Dead and the rest of the hippie bands, doing short, Pop songs with no improvisation. And, they wore suits!). They went East to play a lot, ending up in England with the great Dave Edmunds producing their classic Shake Some Action album, as Loomis said, an absolute masterpiece. It has a very odd sound, very thick and dark, sort of like what Daniel Lanois gave Dylan on the Time Out of Mind album. it didn't work (for me) with Dylan, but does on Shake Some Action.