Jazz for aficionados

*****   It really is true:  "there are only two kinds of music, good and bad".  *****

In the ear of the listener,  this is absolutely true.   And I think this is what the quote means.   There is no definitive 'list' of the good and bad.

Cheers

Rok, I forgot to include, "The Frogman's Reality", and you forgot to include "The Frogman's Kind of Music"; now I guess you want to know what I mean by that. Since I'm not quite sure, you'll have to discern for your self.

Frogman speaks "MUSIC", and that's a language I never took; hear tell they taught it at Julee Yard, that's that school in New York where them classical musicians go to. My huntin dog perks his ears up when Frogman speaks. Did I tell about Mutt? He's my huntin dog that I read to, and I always tell him, "This is what Frogman said", and his ears perk right up; when Frogman speaks, he listens.





Enjoy the music.

We are lucky to have The Frogman on this thread.  He is a professional Jazz and Classical Player.   And I do know that making a living as a Musician is not an easy thing to do.   Esp in a place like NYC, where the entire world is trying to make a career in music.. If he was not very, very good, he would not work.   No room there for 'pretty good'.

Therefore:  EVERYTHING The frogman says about music is true.  We can place more or less emphasis on things as pertains to our own taste in music, but what he says is Gospel.

If he says a group is out of tune, then, they are out of tune.  If you like them in spite of that, that's cool.   That's your right to like music that appeals to you.  We all have that right.

We are all entitled to our own opinions, but not our own facts.  That's why I don't think the term 'reality' is appropriate.  Reality means 'real', which to me, means FACTUAL.  

 We can't have differences of FACT over who is the best  Jazz Trumpet.  We can never know the Best.   We can just give our opinion.   AND, opinions is order to be valid, have to be in the realm of the possible.  You say Morgan, he says Hubbard, and I say Armstrong.  All are within the realm of the possible.  They are all valid opinions.

Naming some guy who plays locally in a club, is not a valid opinion.

And let's remember this is the season of:
Peace on Earth, Good Will towards all Aficionados

Cheers

Rok, Reality is the conjectured state of things as they actually exist, rather than as they may appear or might be imagined. In a wider definition, reality includes everything that is and has been, whether or not it is observable or comprehensible.

The quality or state of being actual or true. The totality of all things possessing actuality, existence, or essence. That which exists objectively and in fact.

music is: the science or art of ordering tones or sounds in succession, in combination, and in temporal relationships to produce a composition having unity and continuity. b : vocal, instrumental, or mechanical sounds having rhythm, melody, or harmony.

Jazz is: American music developed especially from ragtime and blues and characterized by propulsive syncopated rhythms, polyphonic ensemble playing, varying degrees of improvisation, and often deliberate distortions of pitch and timbre.

Well Rok, there you have it.

Hi O-10 - I must say, that is a very interesting definition of jazz, and I would like to hear what the Frogman thinks of it.  

The definition of music is a very basic and good one, too.  I am constantly telling my private horn students that music is the creation of sound in time - the time aspect being as important as the sound aspect, as it is the time (meter and rhythm) that gives the sound a framework, and makes it make sense to the listener.   

This leads to another point that I think has to do with the subject of your post I was objecting to (and by the way, have you explained what point you were trying to make?  If so, I haven't seen it, though I am not 100% certain I am seeing everything in this new forum format):  

When we are discussing heart, or feeling, in music making - it is very important to remember that although this is obviously an essential, it is not the sole essential thing.  One can have all the heart and soul in the world; however, if one cannot express it, because of whatever deficiencies of technique, or an inability to play in time, or an inability to create the right sound, or play in the appropriate style, to name some examples, then one will not really be a good musician.   It is quite possible to have a huge heart and soul, yet not have any real MUSICAL feeling.  All of us musicians have had students like this, and they are sometimes the most frustrating ones, as they have the passion, but not the ability.  One must be able to create good sounds, in time - these qualities are just as important as the heart and soul in the making of music.   That's where the technique, etc. comes in.  

Of course, the reverse example is also true.  Someone can have incredible technique, and fantastic time, but not be a very expressive player.  There are many professional musicians fitting that description, unfortunately, but there are a great many more students who never do win an orchestral audition or regularly get hired to play in jazz clubs, and they have no idea why, because they know they can play their instrument really well.  In fact, this is perhaps more true today than it has been in the past, since the technical standards for every instrument have now risen so high, especially in classical world, but also in the jazz world as well.  The kids coming out of school today have so much more technique than even 25 years ago - but it has come at the expense of other important aspects of music making in general, like learning to phrase really well, to name one aspect important to all genres.  

OK, I'll shut up for now.