Harbeth P3ESR or Monitor 30?

OK, sorry for the belated update.

I ended up auditioning both, and have gone with the P3ESR. While both speakers predictably have strengths and weaknesses, let me begin by saying that the assertions in the above post are ludicrous. I don't mean to suggest that the other speakers mentioned aren't contenders, but the rest is hyperbolic nonsense.

Now, with regard to the two Harbeths, I have chosen the P3s primarily because of what some earlier contributors have noted, namely that they are more open sounding than the M30, and this is especially important in my current, less than ideal space.

I have little doubt that in a room with fine acoustics, and with the right associated equipment, the M30s would be first-class. The highs and mids were superb, even in my space, but they lacked the openness of the smaller speakers, and at times sounded 'boxy'. They also required a more specific and narrow listening position in order to be fully appreciated, while the P3s are quite flexible in that respect.

Having said all of that, I am not as enthusiastic about the P3 bass response as some others on the thread. My expectations were realistic, but I have been a bit underwhelmed. To be fair, I haven't yet done much experimenting with positioning, nor have I tried a different set of spikes, which I will do. So it is still early, and my opinions may evolve.

I do like the speakers quite a bit, but am not sure that they will be with me for years to come. For some perspective, I was more impressed with the bass response of the previous (small) speakers that I was using, a pair of Von Schweikert VR-1, which cost all of 350€.

In any case, thanks for the earlier feedback, and if you have any further thoughts or questions, fire away!

Regards,

Tony C.

Tony - It has been my experience that the bass response of the Harbeth P3esr speakers, if new, will get better with time.  I have also found that the bass can further improve with proper set-up and a well-matched amplifier. Depending on the set-up, I’ve heard the P3 bass sound modest or powerful, and presentation sound detailed and forward or rounded and mid-hall. The P3’s always sound good but can be stellar with some added “effort” and expense.    

Proper stands and placement are essential. The tweeter should be at ear level, which is usually 26 -27” in height. Adding filling material to the stands will change the character of the sound.   Lead shot will sound clearer, more open and bright, while the opposite with kitty litter. The more material added the more noticeable the change.  I use both, with lead shot in the bottom.   Bass response and overall sound quality improved further when I switched from Blu Tack to Herbie’s Audio Lab’s Big Fat Square Dots between the speakers and stands.   I was skeptical but these things really work!  As for speaker placement, each room is different so trial and error is important. My P3’s are about 4’ from the wall in 13’ x 19’ dedicated listening room.  And the bass is stunning for such a small speaker. Tried a sub, but without was best.

You didn’t mention the amplifier used but that too makes a difference.  As you probably know, Harbeth speakers are easy to drive and sound quite good with most suitably powered amplifiers. This would include certain British solid state integrated amplifiers. I have used the P3 speakers with Naim Nait XS2 and SuperNait2 integrated units. The SN2 added some needed warmth and bass response but I still wasn’t satisfied.   I recently tried three other high quality integrated amplifiers, two solid state and one tube. The clear winner was the LFD Zero Mark IV, which had much better bass and PRAT than any other amplifier I have tried. The LFD also had a more natural, mid-hall presentation that sounds as close to real as I’ve ever heard in a stereo system.   The LFD/Harbeth combination is truly extraordinary.   The lack of remote was initially a turnoff, but I use a Logitech WiFi remote to control my source and it works great.

 

 

 

Tony -  Glad to share a few thoughts.  Both of your amplifiers are certainly high quality products, so the "issue" may be more about synergy than anything else.   I glanced at a few reviews of the impressive Rowland Concentra, which seems to be highly regarded and have presentation qualities that are well suited to Harbeth.  It would be interesting to hear your thoughts on the combination at a later date. 

So open stands are fine... but so much for my suggestion about filing material!  The pads from Herbie's Audio Labs might be worth trying. They are  only about $80 and easily returned for full credit.  My guess is that heavy stands benefit more from the pads because they are higher in mass and more likely to ring, but you never know until trying.  

Cheers,
Bruce   

  

Thanks Bruce.

I have used Herbie's products in the past, and am using something similar at the moment. I doubt that a change in that are would confer any big changes.

I'll update when I have further thoughts.

Tony C.