Jazz for aficionados

Frogman - Thanks for those links. Never heard of the guy. It is mind-boggling how many VERY talented people God put on this planet. Amazing.

Am I losing it or just becoming "brainwashed" :-)...in the first link, would you consider that a traditional jazz guitar sound? I liked it more and thought while similar sounding, it was fuller than the sort of muted sound from the Pats, Kenny Burrell and Wes. That does seem like a huge hollow body so maybe that explains what I heard. Or I could just be mistaken.

In the second link where he’s playing solid body electric, his bandmate is playing soprano sax, right? Now that sounded really good to me. It sounded flute-like to my ear not something I associate with soprano sax!

I can see why you would think the guitar work more "my cuppa" seeing how it’s much more of a rock guitar sound. Obviously very talented but do you think he’s a bit "sloppy" (for lack of a better word)...seems to me like he drops notes at the end of a few of his solo runs. Maybe i’m being overly critical. I am very intrigued by that woodwind, whatever it is.

Thanks again.

PS - Thanks for the Wes Montgomery, "The Incredible Jazz Guitar...."  I'm back listening to it.  Wes has something to say that's worth listening.  What I especially like about him is his sense of economy.  AND it is Tommy Flanagan on piano.  Great combination, those two.  A really excellent recording...might have to buy it (contrary to what I said previously).

Strateahed, you obviously have something to say. I certainly would like to read it more often.

Ghosthouse, I dont mind you caling me ’Acman’ as long as you listen to suggestions.
Here is another one, already posted it here, the guitar that you might like more than 'straight' jazz sounding ones

Ivan Joe Jones
https://youtu.be/kUVNIJl6h38?list=PLQex93r41WkEtAKa6U75DHcs6gv1itT3Y

Hello Alex - I try to give credit where it’s due and always want to express my sincere appreciation for the suggestions provided - so my apologies to you!

I will be checking out those Kenny Burrell links. Thank you.

With respect to the earlier albums suggested by Frogman, as you might have read, I went back to the Wes Montgomvery "Incredible Jazz Guitar" album and listened again last night. That one is definitely growing on me...so maybe there is time.

I’ll let you know what I think once I get time to listen.

Ciao.
PS - Well I fired up that Joe Jones link. You are right on the money with that one, Alex. It’s jazz but very funky. If you have more background or info about this style please let me know. VERY enjoyable (though I didn’t think much of the organ solo) - enjoyed his guitar work a ton and liked the (bass?) solo on the outro. Fun stuff.

Great suggestions by Alex, the Kenny Burrell clips in his second to last post are all excellent and leave no doubt as to why he is considered one of the giants of jazz guitar.   Hardly "traditional" Jazz guitar, but I  loved his Ivan Joe Jones clips the first time around and even more this time. Excellent clip with a great feel and live that "Manteca" quote by Rusty Bryant with that amazing gritty tenor sound. I have to get that record.

Ghosthouse, glad you liked the Birelli Lagrene clips; lots more on YouTube. I don’t hear "sloppiness" in his playing. I don’t know if your comment is in reference to his more straight ahead playing (hollow body), his more Rock-oriented solid body playing, or both. I ask because he phrases differently in each style; appropriately so. In his playing on solid body I don’t hear anything that I would consider sloppiness (!). However, in his hollow body playing there is a quality that is perhaps what you refer to; although it is a musical choice in his phrasing style: In jazz phrasing (any instrument) there is a "technique" referred to as "ghosting" (😍) notes. This means that the note(s), within or at the end of the phrase, is implied and not actually sounded. If you look at transcriptions of solos you will see these notes in parentheses. Several times in his solos on hollow body he trails off dynamically at the end of phrases to the extent that you almost can’t hear the final notes. Perhaps that is what you refer to. As I have said previously, I commend your inquisitiveness and since you seem to be so open to suggestions I would, respectfully, suggest that you don’t let the analytical awareness get in the way of the emotional reaction. This relates to something that sometimes, and unfortunately, leads to silly arguments here: the idea that there has to be a devide between the analytical and the emotional (head/brain). Full emotional appreciation of any music does not have to mean absence of analysis; in fact, the two inform each other for a deeper appreciation of the music than is possible by staying in only one camp. Back to guitar and your question about Birelli’s hollow body tone:

There is no ONE "traditional jazz guitar tone". While it is true that compared to a tone that leans more to, or is fully in, the rock or pop camp there can be quite a bit of variety within the "traditional" approach to jazz guitar sound. You prefer a less "sleepy" tone with a little more bite and is why I thought you might like Birelli’s hollow body tone. Nothing wrong with preferring that kind of sound, but tone is the only thing that defines what "traditional" is; what and how the player plays it defines it much more. As I said before, and I hope you don’t mind my saying so (again), I predict that as you listen to more and more "traditional" Jazz the less incisive tone approach will be less of a deal breaker for you. Here is another little known living player who is a bit of a hero to many guitar players amd who plays with a brighter, less muted and more incisive tone:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLZClVvCqkpw3QeQGiBMnrpiP3tZpVENPQ&v=lMurkUZLHXY

Full emotional appreciation of any music does not have to mean absence of analysis; in fact, the two inform each other for a deeper appreciation of the music than is possible by staying in only one camp.

Well said, Frogman.  I completely agree.  I've had enough music training over the years to now know that I don't know...but that's another story.  I like getting the technical analysis from you.  

Thanks for addressing many of my questions and comments.

Your description of "ghosting" with respect to the Birelli Lagrene playing fits to a T what I thought was sloppiness  - but it was in the 2nd link where he plays solid body electric that I noticed it.  It was in a couple of his solo runs towards the end, and before he does a kind of duet with the (soprano sax?) player.  

Yup, did like his hollow body tone.   Anything unusual about the size of it?  Also, any comments about the soprano sax sound??

To Alex - I did just listen to the Tommy Flanagan/Burrell "Blues In My Heart".  But probably more to hear TF.  I had noticed the piano playing in that Wes Montgomery "Incredible Jazz Guitar" LP.  It's Flanagan.  Gosh there and in the Bluebird LP he displays such great taste and style.  "Less is more" always made a lot of sense to me.  He has that in spades.  I think that is what works so well in that Wes Montgomery recording.  They both seem to have this great restraint (balance, maybe) in their playing.  Nothing over done, nothing forced, no unnecessary notes.  Somebody else has a better way to describe it, I'll listen.  

O - did you guys already cover Flanagan?

I gotta get some chores done around here.  Thanks to all for your time and input.  Much appreciated.