Vinyl and subwoofers

Hi cleeds and ct0517,
I have my turntable on the top of a rack 5ft high on top of a 2x2 ft slab of marble. The stand sits on points that sit on carpet and go through to a concrete floor. The speakers are each 4 ft away from the turntable and are also on spikes that go through the carpet into the concrete floor. This is also true for the sub. Since I've started listening to vinyl, I've had 5 different cartridges, two tables, and 6 phono stages. Woofer pumping has ocurred with all configurations, meaning I have got the set up wrong about 10 times. In my mind it is not plausible. Perhaps this pumping is because the Thiels go down to 20hz. As I've said before, without the sub, the pumping has not been audible, just visually bothersome. The worst record for this is Boxer, by the National.

golferboy

I have my turntable on the top of a rack 5ft high on top of a 2x2 ft slab of marble. The stand sits on points that sit on carpet and go through to a concrete floor. The speakers are each 4 ft away from the turntable and are also on spikes that go through the carpet into the concrete floor. This is also true for the sub. Since I've started listening to vinyl, I've had 5 different cartridges, two tables, and 6 phono stages. Woofer pumping has ocurred with all configurations, meaning I have got the set up wrong about 10 times. In my mind it is not plausible. Perhaps this pumping is because the Thiels go down to 20hz.

If you have a subwoofer four feet from your turntable, that's quite likely part of your problem. Please feel free to think it's "not plausible" that you have a setup problem, but consider this: How do you explain that other Lp setups - with bass extension at least the equal of yours - do not have woofer pumping/rumble problems?

Hi Golferboy

"The worst record for this is Boxer, by the National"

The band recorded Boxer with producer Peter Katis, with vocalist Matt Berninger stating, "We recorded a lot of it at home. Probably half and half of home recording and recording with Peter in the studio. We always kind of work that way, going in and out of studios and then back home. We have little home set-ups. .....

taken from here

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boxer_(album)

Sounds like a good candidate for recording venue related to me. But I do not own the album.

All the album tracks here. have been listening to it :^)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aHaln2drAdc&list=PLVKXUV0dJqqmO-Sac6-4Dl1myCMDGGTAx&index=2

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If you bring a woofer into a speaker repair shop to have it fixed, before they give it back to you they run a test signal through it.

from memory sending a 10 - 20 hz through a 12 inch woofer will make it oscillate violently and depending on design it will eventually stop above that.

re your Classe Amp

As a Canadian I have owned my share of Classe amps.

Going from memory again.

Re; The CA series I remember talking to Robert of Classe in Montreal. He told me their design was "more - and smaller" capacitors for quick energy transfer.  The drawback I found with CA - 300 and 400 was a rounded bass. It sounded good - tube like in the mids and higher. But the bass was bettered by both my Krell and modded Music Reference RM9 Tube Amp with KT-88 tubes. I also remember having to have the speakers closer to boundaries with the Classe. The speakers were able to moved back out with the other amps.

You have been through many phono stages. Did any previous pre/phono stages have a subsonic filter ?

Fun thread BTW.

First place to start: What is the subwoofer's crossover point?

In my HT, my mains go strongly down to 29Hz and audibly to 26 Hz. If my crossover to the sub is set higher than 40 Hz, I get muddy bass and lower midrange. 

cleeds,
Can't explain why others don't have the problem and I can't explain why others do. "Not plausible" does not rule out the possibility that the setup is screwy. That said, ok ok, I'll check it. :) Why is having the sub only 4 ft away from table a problem with concrete?
ct0517,
No stage had a filter. I have no doubt that a Krell is better...just wish I had the bucks.