Is my amp the problem?


I recently decided to bi-amp my speakers so I purchased a crown xls 1002. (225w 8 ohm). I am driving a 10 woofer. It sounds horrible. I can't seem to get it to put out much power despite its rating even when I make all the right adjustments. Its a class D amp. Is that my problem? It just doesn't seem to have any Ba**s. Lol. Advice is appreciated.
jimbones
Something doesn't seem right here; the 225 wpc should drive the bass driver well. Is this an open baffle design, which might account for the disappointment in low end. More info needed. 

While the Crown may be poor quality there should be plenty of bass happening. I suspect something else wrong. I concur with Al that it may be in the setup. Even a poorer amp will not sound "horrible" or unlistenable when set up correctly. A profound lack of bass and horrible sound is evidence something is way off track. I suspect mis-wiring in the system. 
Thanks for the additional info. I can’t say what the answer is at this point, but here are some thoughts and possibilities to consider:

1)You didn’t say which miniDSP model you are using as the crossover, but I see that the "2x4," which appears to be a likely possibility, has a maximum rated output of 0.9 volts. The sensitivity of the Crown amp is selectable as either 1.4 volts or 0.775 volts. If you have not set it to 0.775 volts that could certainly be a contributing factor. Also, my suspicion is that those two numbers apply to its balanced inputs, which could mean that the corresponding figures for the unbalanced inputs are twice those numbers. If so, it can be calculated that even if you are using the 0.775 volt setting an input of 0.9 volts would not drive the amp to more than about 72 watts into the 8 ohm nominal impedance of the woofer, which is about 1/3 of its rated power capability.

2)The miniDSP 2x4 has a very low input impedance of 6K. While your Modwright tube preamp has a specified output impedance of 300 ohms, I suspect that as with most tube preamps its output impedance rises to much higher values in the deep bass region, due to the coupling capacitor it most likely uses at its output. Many tube preamps having nominal output impedances of a few hundred ohms have output impedances in the area of 2K to 4K at 20 Hz. If that is the case with the LS100 (and you might check with Dan Wright on that), and if you are using the 2x4 or some other miniDSP model having a similar input impedance, it would certainly explain a weakness in the deep bass region.

3)Although you stated that "all the right adjustments" have been made, between the plethora of settings in the amp and in the miniDSP there is lots of opportunity to go wrong. So double and triple checking everything would seem to be in order. For starters, be sure of course that your settings result in the amps being properly gain matched. And be sure that the high pass, low pass, and bandpass filter functions the amp provides have been either turned off or set to values that would not contribute to the problem.

4)Regarding the comments by the others, the woofer you are using does not seem to be a particularly difficult load, and I would not expect it to require a particularly high current amp. See the impedance plot in this datasheet, which shows its impedance as being at or above 7 ohms at all frequencies, and not having particularly negative (capacitive) phase angles at most frequencies. Although it should be noted that the rise to as much as 30 ohms in the vicinity of 30 Hz means that at frequencies in that vicinity the amp’s power capability will be far less than the 215 watts it can supply into 8 ohms. Although a similar reduction in power capability into the high impedances at those frequencies would occur with nearly all solid state amps.

Hope that helps. Regards,
-- Al

If you are using miniDSP, can we hope this means you have the ability to measure your response? Most likely it's an EQ problem, or sensitivity mismatch.

I use OmniMic, but Room EQ Wizard also works.

Best,


Erik
So can we assume you have bypassed the internal crossovers and replicated them in miniDSP?

That's usually the easiest way to go. Test 1 driver with the passive crossover. Adjust miniDSP until your active filter looks the same. Repeat with next. Make sure your sensitivity matches before and after.

Best,


Erik

@almarg - You are totally correct.  I didn't even think about the miniDSP.  In addition to the input impedance issue, all the miniDSP devices will convert the analog input to digital before doing the crossover processing - then converting back to analog.  These conversion steps as well as the very poor power supply section of the miniDSP will just kill any sound quality benefit you would be getting from the Modwright preamp or audio source.  You would do better to look for an analog-only crossover.  There are a couple of Bryston 10B crossovers for sale on Audiogon.  They have input impedance of 15k ohms, much better than miniDSP.  Also, completely analog and much superior power supply.

That being said, I did think of one more thing.  You should consider any built-in passive crossover inside your speaker.  Are you using a manufactured speaker?  Or something you built yourself (DIY).  The internal crossovers of the speaker will conflict with any active crossover. While you could potentially set the active crossover above/below the internal crossover points, you are just wasting a step.  If you do have internal crossovers in your speakers, you are just better off using a Y-splitter cable to go to two separate amps and take the active crossover out of the system completely.  On a 2-way speaker, you could potentially just bypass any crossover wiring internally and wire directly to the speakers.  If it is a 3-way (or higher), this becomes more complicated because you'll need to have some sort of internal speaker crossover to separate between mid/tweeter.  The internal crossover will have this, but it will also have a high-pass section to rolloff the woofer frequencies.

If you can't control this and it's a manufactured speaker, an idea would be to connect the Modwright amp to the mid/high binding posts and not use an active crossover for this at all.  For the woofer, you could use an active crossover to the Crown amp, but then wire the crown amp directly to the woofer (do not use the internal woofer crossover).  All this will require some DIY work on the speaker to accomplish.

Let me know if I haven't explained these ideas correctly.