Where is the significant point of diminishing returns on hi-end turntable?

Guys,

I have written extensively on the fraud of vinyl in today's modern audio world.

If 65 dB (1/2 that of say a snare drum) and that "warm sound" (meaning 2nd degree harmonic distortion) is good enough for you then vinyl is your choice. You get a low resolution, high distortion format that is dead.

Note: CD is dead too as its not enough digital material to make a truly "analogous" reproduction of music compared to a 24-bit 96 (or 192) kHz file which is in effect a direct copy of the master tape. YES PEOPLE - you can buy meaningful music in volume at master tape quality. HDTrack.com and elsewhere. 

You can buy all the cool gear in the world here on Audiogon.com thus essentially creating an audiophile Ferrari. The SECOND you spin one lame-ass, low resolution LP and you've fueled said Ferrari with 50 octane gas. I will take a pair of $600 Elacs, a small Elac integrated amp, a small subwoofer and some 24 bit files in a CHEAP system and blow one of these Ferrari's out of the water in term of performance while saving TENS upon TENS of thousands of dollars. Buck up for better gear and room acoustics - and the experience only gets better. A LOT better. I am just saying you can't fake master tape quality audio as a starting point people.

Most importantly, and I get punished for saying this by readers and even some advertisers, the audiophile hobby is literally and figuratively DYING. The people who design the gear, sell the gear and who buy the gear have made it a nerdy, one-person sitting in a dark room hobby and its not growing. The so-called and unfounded resurgence of vinyl is promoting the sales of music on a physically degrading media in the used domain. It speaks in NO WAY to the future of the format and its future audiences who listen to tons of music - but more streaming and on their phones. CD is a dead format but it sold 100x more volume according to SoundScan last year. New vinyl in its entirety is a "multi-platinum" format. That's right EVERY DISC SOLD sells about 3m units. EA Sports can sell more Madden Football in 30 minutes than all of vinyl in an entire year across all format. People want high resolution over retro tech snobbery.

I ask you to consider the way you look at your system and its future. Do you listen to music in its highest resolution? Do you stream every CD known to man for $20 per month (yes, Tidal is pretty cool and would only be the BEST if they went HD via MQA) or are you stuck in the past? If you are stuck - consider this post an invite to change. Its not too late and there a lot to gain including making ALL of the investments you've made in your system sound EVEN BETTER. 

hometheaterreview, thanks for the totally off point comment. Maybe you should go watch a movie.

I have to laugh when someone writes that a media is dead. I don't give a rat's a$$. I have over 100 LPs, 80 CDs, a few SACDs, DVD-As and HDCDs. I am not going to put them in the trash no matter what. I got a better TT and cartridge last year. I enjoy my LPs more now. I got a better CD player this year. I enjoy my CDs more now. 

Dear @sbank : You are rigth, LIVE MUSIC must or should be the REFERENCE and nothing else.
 For me that's means that we must to stay in " constant " touch with as each one time could permit it.

All other kind of music experiences can enrich each one audio system experiences and each one control over that audio system.

Every audio system ( " poor " one or extremely expensive ones. ) can make " sound " but only  a few can make MUSIC: can really put us nearest to the MUSIC and how all human beens are " involved " by that MUSIC. Digital and Analog can make MUSIC but that does not depends on the media each one we use but depends on each one of us knowledge level and skills.

You, @rushton , @mmporsche , me and any one else are where we are not because the audio system it self but because each one of us skills and knowledge levels to fullfil each one targets. I can say I'm almost " there " as many of you.
Many of our audio systems only makes sound not MUSIC and we need to learn how to achieve this last target.

@rushton did not arrives where he is with the today system, he learned and I'm sure that he still do it even today. I know I'm doing as you Spencer.

Normally is the audio system whom has the overall control over us and only when we start to change that fact to be we the ones that have the control is when the system start to make MUSIC.

Audio life is an audio life full of frustrations till we " arrive ".

I don't know what @mmporsche could think when through the time he suddenly listen other person home audio system where he takes in count it performs really better than his 80-90K+ home system but where those experiences came from a humble 30K system!!!

I already has experiences listening 200-350K systems where what I listened was only sound. Those audio systems are the ones that has the CONTROL not the owners of it.

Regards and enjoy the music,
R.

Rushton, I was doing something unrelated to music or stereo, and it hit me, "Rushton said 25K was not the point of diminishing returns for him". What is the point where he feels comfortable, since 25K isn't even close.

could you give me an idea of what tone arm, cartridge, and TT you feel comfortable with?

I listened to a 100% top of the line ARC reference system that had been set up by the masters in a "High End Salon", and I heard things I had never heard before on a "Santana" CD. "Abraxas" was the name of the CD, and I wore out a few copies of the LP, so I was quite familiar with it; I'm wondering just how much more could I have heard on the LP?

Usually I end with "Enjoy the music", but if I had a megabuck analog rig, I would be so focused on the rig, that I wouldn't be able to enjoy the music. Do you focus on the rig, or the music?

I'm sure in selecting individual items for an analog rig, you don't say, "Give me dis dat and the other thing" (an attempt at humor) How do you select these world class components? Do you fly to Zurich to audition a tone arm or TT, or do they send you several for your inspection?


Enjoy the music.